dat2kman

What are we missing?We are missing written on Nissan letterhead, stating what was built, with what, fitted. Morgan, Porsche, MG, Shelby, all have provided written on letterhead stating what they did. Thats what is missing. Yes, there are plenty of magazine articles, hotographs, the dutch website, on the works cars, lots. But, nothing from the manufacturer. Hung, when CAMS refers to competion variants, to be in MO or T, these are the Group 4 cars, and must be the original genuine race car, as used on circuits, with a documented history, such as my Datsun Sports 2000 Group O/T car Note, that rule was also a recent introduction, in order to keep cars out of Group S, due to their much higher spec levels, apparently, they are extremely very highly modified, or so some in the Group S heirarchy would have all believe!

And a quick question about zeds and group S that Jason may be able to answer (sorry Gav !!) - why is it that the spec sheet says 240Z production was from Oct 69, yet they are still classed as Sc ? I would have thought that would make them Sb ? David, that was due them first being available for sale to the public, by dealers around the World. If they were being sold, in 1969, in Japan, and there was evidence of that, then that case can be put to CAMS, yet once again. It all comes down to documentary evidence. Prior to Group Sc, it was just Group S, which was originally for cars manufactured prior to Dec 31. 1969 They then introduced Sc and, once again, ( a bit of a habit,) changed the rules, to "made and sold" Jan 1 1970 to Dec 31 1976 Initially it was for Australian sold cars only, but, ,,,, the rules got changed, to world cars Prior to Sc introduction, the Datsun Sports 2000's ruled Group S, and there is a bit of contention about the rule re-writes, as there were some non Datsun fans, that knew the 240Z may come under Sb As the S30 shell and its mechanicals remained basically unchanged, the 260Z, and potentially 280Z could have all been admitted as Sb, due to then then rules written for what was known as "model run on" Classic case in point, Group N Touring cars finish in 1972, yet cars made in 1973-4, that are badically same spec, are permitted under the "model run on" provisions.

Those 30 odd cars, Alan, are the rally cars, and, as they were registered for road use, from new, fitted with particular parts, will be accepted as "production" cars. Our Elegibility Chair is quite aware of them, and the issue of stickers/signwriting, has no bearing, they just had to be made, from new, and then registered for road use, the fact that quite a number were assembled by Nissan, at a Nissan owned and managed preparation facility ( does not need to be a regular production lune) Cars that were assembled, by either a factory, or a dealer, for purposes of circuit racing competition, ie FIA Group 4, ( Sports Prototype) and not registered for road use, will not be considered, these are deemed as "Specials" . Group 2 was quite standard, Group 3 was for mild modifications, as produced by manufacturers. In our CAMS Homologation papers, CAMS has, in fact, ruled out certain items as " Not Allowed, Group 4 only", for things like fibreglass hanging panels, e CAMS has further altered the the FIA/JAF papers, for Australian use. It is this document, that we can prepare the Group S cars to. Our "special" friend, does not quite grasp much of this, and thinks that the USA will provide all the answers, we both know that is not the case.

Do they do just a phillips head set? Cant seem to see it. The flat blades are a bit pointless, A double set of Phillips style would be preferable!

That Ebay unit, in the OP, states its from Ballarat Vic. Isn't that Steve Newing at EFI Hardware? Just buy it direct from him! A not so often on here chap from Sydney, told me about his LO-Budget alternative to these expensive TB+ Inject units,, brilliant dea, and so simple! Get a decent triple Weber type manifold, weld bosees on, at near to head, at an angle, fit injectors, hook up a rail, run the usual high pressure fuel control, then, just bolt on a old set of 45dcoe's, dont need to be matched, no need for chokes or aux venturies,, run them dry, and gutted, they just control air! A TPS, a MAP or similar, air temp sensor, hooked up to any basic type ECU, controlling injects and ign. Best bit, compared to all these TB+Inj, you are shooting the fuel steaight at the backside of the intakes! What problems would arise from this?

Gav, I'm happy to let this run, after all, I started this topic!!,, some years back, when I was getting supply of seals, pistons, and pads for the MK63's And, along with 7" wide rims, triple Solex carbs, and the vented rotors, that were fitted to around 30 new cars, and then used on roads, around the world, there aren't too many out there trying to get somewhere with this. The other stuff, also in the Option lists, that we want/have, has all been previously allowed, ie LSD, various diff ratios, close ratio gearboxes, modifications to suspension perch heights, 3 deg of Neg camber, engine modifications, plastic windows, and others. They certainly weren't produced standard, like this! If some of the current Historic Production Sports car racers, or enthusiasts, wish to kick off a new thread on that, go for it! Most organisations have those rare certain "special" people, that many within the organisation have to put up with, dont say anything about them, but realuse full well, that, yes, some are rather "unique" It's not until it is raised in actual conversation, that there are a great many, that are in 100% full agreeance Funnily enough, there's another general car type forum, where these "interesting" folk seem to not be able to sustain their little charades, have a big girly tanty, and retire, the rest could'nt give a flying rats arse about the departure! Hilarious!

Hung, Alan Hamilton Porsche, in South Yarra, fitted the 7/8's to new cars, in place of the factory 6's and 6/7''s I have the FIA Homologation papers as to what was factory fitted Have gone over all this, seen the letters, on that dealers letterhead, stating he was fitting the wider rims to customer new vehicles. Have had talks with the then Chair of Elegibility. Also have letters ( copies) from other car makers, that got them what they were asking for. Nothing new here!

Cant help with long tube pickup, but do have two sump pans with the bowl more forward, also a ZX sump, with bowl to the rear, if thats any help!

The four cylinder guys are now getting anxious over certain casting numbered blocks, for their stroker combos! Getting rarer and rarer!

Guys,,, The above comes from a bloke that has never quite grasped what a Gp S Datsun is. Has never raced, and thinks that single lap sprints are the ultimate. By making correct approaches to CAMS and Elegibility, certain items do get accepted, just like other manufacturers have had certain items accepted. I got Webers for Datsun Roadsters, helped the Group N Datsun 1600's get the FSC71A five speed gearbox, assisted in getting 15" diameter wheels for Datsun Z. It can be done, it needs the correct aporoach, and guidance from the Historic Elegibity Committee. When cockheads like 260detrimental come wading in with all their "experience",,,,, no one wants to know about it. As I have said, in past, we only need evidence of manufacture, or dealer fitment, to a new car, and then that car is used on public roads. I have never said that these cars have to had been sold! And certainly not sold to the general public. We do not need to show that these cars were sold, just made for use on roads. ( they cannot be Group 4 - Competition Variants, for race use only, as per FIA Homologation papers) These road registered Datsun Z's were assembled by Nissan Japan, with certain items from the options parts lists, then they were registered for public road use, by the factory. The factory also sent brand new cars to a dealer in Woking, England, and the dealer DT Dobie in Africa. These dealers then also fitted items to these new cars, with only delivery miles on the odos. Also registered for public roads. The Chairman of the Australuan Historic Elegibility committee is fully aware of these particular cars, has been introduced, by me, to a number of websites, documents, photos etc, and would like to help us. But, and this is the major BUT, we need evidence, on Nissan letterhead, or, from those two dealers, on their letterhead, a statement outlining what they did, what they fitted,to these new cars, and the registration numbers. This then backs up the other information supplied and acknowledged. 260det contributes jackshit to this sort of stuff, then delights in berating people. just stick to your Ferguson Tractor driven cast iron framed 270kphfastest eva at Bathurst, Sports Sedan, and leave the important stuff to those that know what they are doing, and who are attempting to do things correctly and work with and understand the processes required at these levels.

well,It would very much seem so! By who, and, more to the point, Why? The relevance to not only MK63 calipers, but other items, as the discussion evolves, may well be seen by others, as interesting and informative. Certainly from the history of the car's perspectives. Not all may own the rare ones.

I'll look at what I have. Bear in mind -all length of valve of a P90 is different to N42 heads, as the bowl sits up higher in the chamber.

$1600 for a 2.9 unit, fully rekitted, with all reciepts, is a good price. These have the 0.83 fifth gear, desireable! Same sold recently for $1800 a couple months back.

Incorrect, again,,,, The cars were never assembled in USA just sold there, so there is ZERO point in wasting resources going that route. They could buy parts, and fit them onto a "used" car though. No USA Dealer supplied new, off the lot, with said items fitted, for public road use.

I have a few from various Datsuns, over the years. Can you post a pic of what one you need?

Oh, and weight, The MK63 vs S12-8, They are all almost the same weight, vented vs vented. I dont have the non vented mk63, but you can be pretty well assured, the non vents are also very close. Main differences, external casting markings and a bit of ribbing, piston diams in the Toyotas are unequal, and, seal section sizes and dimensions are slightly different. No, you cant fit the atoyata seal kit, to a MK63, and, no, the brake pads also dont swap between them.

Re the MK63's being used in Gp S AKA "Historic PRODUCTION Sports Cars" I have been told, on a number of occaisions, by our Chairman of the CAMS Historic Elegibility Committee, "Show us evidence of any Datsun Z car being built, and fitted, with these particular items, as a new car, off ANY production line, or assembled by Nissan, at ANY factory, or fitted by ANY dealer, to a new car, that was then used on public roads, and registered, in any country, and we, CAMS will give you these items, however, it cant have been buiot as a racing car, for use on a circuit" Nissan assembled a few Z's ( approx 30, i know most of the registration numbers, dates, and where the cars were used) fitted with good stuff, then had them registered, and then sent to South Africa, UK and Europe, one of those very cars was sent to Australia Now, the Morgan Motor Company, in Wales, and the MG Car Co in UK, has done the above, and, certain items were accepted. Here is the fly in the ointment,,,,,, We dannot get documentary evidence that Nissan assembled these cars, from Nissan, on Nissan company, or Dealer/Concessionare letterhead ! Bloody frustrating. Just because its in the Option Parts catalogues, that means diddly squat, it has to have been all bolted onto a NEW car, by Nissan Oh, the cars?? Road registered 240/260/280Z's sed in rallying, in Africa, England and Europe! Including the car Dunkerton drove in Australia, that had the original Japanese registration plates fitted!

Unless swapped over.Have seen a few with filler on RHS, get all excited, only to find standard, or ute/truck ratios, inside!

Because pirates,,,,

Actually,,,, we do not drink Fosters here, its absolute rubbish, thats why we send it to the rest of the World When we're OS, we all know to not consume it!

Let me get out the crystal ball!!!No idea, until you count tit. Who knows what may or may not have been swapped over the years! PITA with box in car, but, jack it up, remove all spark plugs, set front pulley on tdc, put it into gear, climb under, mark the tailshaft with a white dot, attach a pointer stick to a nearby bolt, position tip of pointer at the dot. Hop up, ratchet socket on crank pulley, rotate It three full turns Climb back under. Check the white dot relative to the pointer, ifs its just close, its a 2.9 first gear. ( 3 turns of the crank is close enough to 2.9) If the dot is further away, its a 3.32 ratio first gear Doug the two shafts method is good, make sure whatever telltale stick etc on output, doesnt move, use a dab of superglue and a bit of plastic stick, for input shaft, use an old clutch plate, mark it to a return reference point. If you select first, rotate input 2.9/3.0 times, output will do one rev back to start, shes a 2.9!

Jake,,,, Richo is building a real racecar, with 40mm of ground clearance, and 700 donkeypower, Muzza's units just wont cut it!

Easy enough to pull the bell and ext off, and do an accurate tooth count, to confirm! Some variants of the 280ZX did come with those ratios, but other variants, had the truck/ute ratio gearboxes fitted, ie first gear is 3.52 They also had various diff ratios fitted to better utilise such variances in gear ratio sets. This box above, if its 3.06 first gear, is almost as good as the desired 260Z 2.9 ratio box, save for the laggy fifth gear, but thats very easily swapped for a more spirited .832 regular fifth gear!

Well, the S30 never came with the MK63 fitted standard, on any factory built or supplied car, so why should they be permitted under FIA rules, for Prduction Sports cars, built to period requirements!

And THATS why you do a trial assembly first, with light tack welds, and once fitted, car set to near desired heights, then measurements at static are taken, allowances for bump and droop, measurements, and then calculate shock insert required dimensions, then off the scrounge the catalogues, then, once procured, section the strut, and reweld to suit the new shock insertLike I said, have a look at the Toyato MR2 rear inserts. The canned MCA's will give bump/rebound valving adjustability, in both slow and fast cycling, but going on what you are doing, the regular range of MCA as built units, will be too long ( very low ride height Ferguson Tractor Z31 Spurting Sedan race car,,,,,) What about fabricating a double A-arm wishbone front end, and run a coilover type body shock absorber? I'd attach images, but Gav tells us the server s a bit chockers