How many z's

[charleszed]

Hi,

Just curious what the number of datsun 240z's and especially the number of 260z 2 seater's where brought to australia.

 

my vin is rs 30100029???

ten thousandth or 29th

[gilltech]

One hundred thousand & twenty-ninth isn't it? What year?

 

FWIW my early-'74-spec 260 2-seat is 000115 sold new in NZ, there were quite a number of others there at one time with close VIN numbers to mine.

Some detail differences between Australian-spec & general-spec (incl NZ) cars.

I would say that quite a number have crossed the Tasman either way over the years so they're all mixed up by now. I brought mine over to Qld in 2007.

 

As to how many Zeds were sold new here, the subject has come up before on this forum but IIRC the estimated total was inconclusive.

 

[charleszed]

thanks for info gilltech,

 

mine is a 1975

i didnt think that there was that many 2 seat 26oz's

no one really knows it seems,

i was talking to a datsun guy and he said there was only 600 of them brought over??

 

[gilltech]

I'm surprised, I would have thought more than 600 RS30s would have been sold new in Australia?

 

I've been told there were about 200 260s sold new in NZ which is a much smaller country. But again, no-one seems to have kept any definitive records, unless someone has been able to trawl through registration records in more modern times.

Mind you, maybe the '70s market was quite different here, as you had a lot of home-grown Australian designed cars.

 

[gav240z]

When it comes to 240z's I hear a number of around 3000-4000 were brought into Australia. I'm not sure how many 260z 2 seaters were imported but it was significantly less than 240z's apparently.

 

By far we got the most 2+2's. I've been wondering for years if we could get an answer to this. Does anyone have any ideas?

 

I feel like there is not many left, I'd guess less than 5% in total have survived. Based on similar threads and discussions on the US based forums.

 

Also worth noting is the fact that HS30 00016 was sold in New Zealand, George's #19 sold here and #4 sold here. So it's possible that many of the early VIN 240z's (HS30 prefixed cars) were peppered between AU and NZ and I'm not sure what number Fairlady 240z's (stamped as HS30 also - starting in 71 for the home market) were counted in amongst our AU and NZ delivered cars also.

 

My guess is that they were

[gav240z]

I'm surprised, I would have thought more than 600 S30s would have been sold new in Australia?

 

I've heard that number (600) quoted around 260z 2 seaters (RS30 prefixed cars).

 

2+2's of course were delivered in large numbers and they obviously sold well and at much larger volume than that.

[George]

I've heard that number (600) quoted around 260z 2 seaters (RS30 prefixed cars).

 

Which would make the 260's a rarer model

 

For what it's worth, some figures here (however accurate they may be): http://zhome.com/History/Zproduction.html

[HS30-H]

For what it's worth, some figures here (however accurate they may be): http://zhome.com/History/Zproduction.html

 

Not even remotely accurate, actually.

 

It's a constant annoyance that zhome.com leaves them up there for people to refer to them and be misled by them...

[HS30-H]

my vin is rs 30100029???

ten thousandth or 29th

 

In fact it's neither.

 

It's simply the car with the chassis number 'RS30-100029', that's all.

 

Nissan Shatai (the company which actually made these cars) would put significant gaps in the numbering sequences as and when it suited them. Usually it was done to draw a line between one spec and another, a production-date related cut-off or some other necessity. And it was done for their benefit rather than ours. It's no wonder we sometimes struggle to make sense of it all.

 

So, 'mind the gap'... 

[44014]

260z 2 seater Complied 10/74

[sydney mike]

Well that is strange, mine is RS30-015093 but it is 10/76 build, first rego'ed Dec '77. So lower VIN# but later built or is your post a typo? 

 

So Alan is right in saying that these numbers make no sense to us, only to Nissan.

 

Does this make a mockery of people who place importance on low VIN #'s?

 

In saying that, I'd still love an early girl with the hatch vents.

 

 

 

Hi,

Just curious what the number of datsun 240z's and especially the number of 260z 2 seater's where brought to australia.

 

my vin is rs 30100029

ten thousandth or 29th

 

Did you mean one hundred thousandth or is it a typo?

 

thanks for info gilltech,

 

mine is a 1975

i didnt think that there was that many 2 seat 26oz's

no one really knows it seems,

i was talking to a datsun guy and he said there was only 600 of them brought over??

[boyblunda]

Would not the RS30 designation be given to all 260Z right hand drive two seaters worldwide?

 

There has been previous mention on this forum of the early RS30 models being "light bodied" 260Z's with up to a 1000(?) of these being released. I own RS30 000812 and have previously owned RS30 000783 (now a parts car), both of which are supposed to have been of this ilk, for want of a better word.

 

The WAZ Register is currently compiling a list of known S30 vehicles, both running and those that have met their final end. The Register relies on people registering the details of their own cars and we should encourage owners to support that project. 

[HS30-H]

So Alan is right in saying that these numbers make no sense to us, only to Nissan.

 

Does this make a mockery of people who place importance on low VIN #'s?

 

We can make pretty good sense of them (although some prefixes are easier than others...) but essentially we are doing what the archaeologists did with ancient Egyptian hieroglyphics. We are working backwards.

 

It doesn't really make a mockery of the 'Low VIN Bingo' game as long as we remember that although the prefixes and body serial number combinations were engraved on the firewalls in a set - linear - sequence, the cars weren't necessarily completed, or emerged from the factory with their 'OK' stickers applied, in exactly that linear, sequential, order...

 

We have to be a bit pragmatic. 

[HS30-H]

Would not the RS30 designation be given to all 260Z right hand drive two seaters worldwide?

 

Yes. There was only one body serial number sequence with the 'RS30' prefix. There was only one body serial number sequence for each prefix (S30 / PS30 / HS30 / HLS30 / RS30 / RLS30 / GS30 / GRS30 / GRLS30 / S31 / GS31 etc etc....) 

 

There has been previous mention on this forum of the early RS30 models being "light bodied" 260Z's with up to a 1000(?) of these being released. I own RS30 000812 and have previously owned RS30 000783 (now a parts car), both of which are supposed to have been of this ilk, for want of a better word.

 

I think all this "light bodied 260Z" stuff is just people trying to make sense of things retrospectively. It's a bit like that north American "Series 1" and "Series 2" talk. It's just a way for us civilians to try to explain differences that the factory never fully explained to us because it's actually none of our business.

 

I've heard and read silly stories where people talk about the factory "...using up old 240Z parts on early 260Zs", as though Nissan and Nissan Shatai never really had much of a handle on what they were actually doing. Most of the parts on these cars were made just a few weeks before they went on the cars, and if anyone thinks that Nissan 'accidentally' popped off a few thousand extra body pressings or struts without realising that the RS30 and RLS30 were going to be starting production in a couple of weeks then they have no clue what they are talking about. These cars were planned down to the last screw and rivet, and there was no mountain of surplus parts to use up.       

 

 

[George]

Not even remotely accurate, actually.

 

It's a constant annoyance that zhome.com leaves them up there for people to refer to them and be misled by them...

 

I was counting the minutes until your reply and I mean that in the nicest possible way.

[boyblunda]

Alan, thankyou for the above input. I very much appreciate the clear, patient, objective contributions you make to these discussions - they certainly add to my education.

 

So I went back to one of my previous references and found that indeed, I had not read it properly. The body differences made in the construction of the new 260Z model that I thought were differences between the 240Z and the 260Z were, according to Service Bulletin Vol.215 Modification Of Datsun 260Z Model S30 Series 1974 applied to new models starting with RS30 005001.

Larger airflow opening in radiator core support

Floor underside heightened by 20mm

Floor tunnel changed to accommodate brake and fuel lines

Stronger modified front seat bracket

Reinforced side and cross members

Lower differential mounting member

Rear strut housing to accommodate larger rear sized strut

Front tie down hook strengthened and can be used as towing hook

Spare tyre housing moved to the left 30mm

Rear panel modified for exhaust

Other changes (eg suspension)  were made to allow parts  to be interchangeable with the new 2+2 model and for "increased strength.

The curb weight of the revised model is given as 1085 kg 0r 2392 lbs.

 

Perhaps this early revision of the newly introduced 260Z is that which contributes to the thinking about the possible weight differences between 260Z models.

 

This is a little off track from the original topic but it does give an example of Alan's warning about being aware of the gaps that might appear in the numbers.

 

(Add Edit) If we look at the WAZ Register we can see that there were 15 RS30 260Z's with numbers ranging between RS30 000458 and RS30 1057 but the next number in sequence is RS30 005166. The build dates lodged for these vehicles are, only loosely sequential.

 

Before the issue arises again, there was a new 260Z model in 1976 starting from RS30 015001.

[gav240z]

Hi Alan,

 

Thanks for chiming in on this thread, if there's anyone who can help shed some light on this topic I'm sure it is you.

 

So this is my understanding:

 

HS30 cars would have been sent to RHD based countries or regions. So this would include:

 

- Japanese Home Market cars fitted with an L24 (Fairlady 240z and Fairlady 240zg HS30-Hs)

- Australia

- New Zealand

- United Kingdom

 

and possibly others like:

 

- South Africa?

- Ireland?

- Malta?

- South America?

 

 

I put question marks next to counties/regions I'm not sure received S30z's? I do know for example that South Africa received a lot of Datsun's so I can only assume S30z's were included in the mix. A further assumption is that Ireland did also, although probably in very small numbers and I only included Malta because it's the only other RHD country I'm aware of in Europe.

 

So in the case of HS30 00150, I know that HS30 00149 and HS30 00151 were all sold in Australia and perhaps clusters of finished cars were sent off that way? However is it possible that other cars like (just as an example HS30 00148* - which was likely to be Safari Gold) could have been sent to any of the other HS30 based destinations?

 

*Just wanted to emphasise I don't know where this car is now. If it even exists still.

 

To give more colour to where I'm going my 72 240z is HS30 10552 and I don't think it's the 10552 produced 240z sold in Australia. It's unlikely we got 10,000 240z's sent our way. Rather it could be 10552nd sold produced HS30 car globally?

 

Or from what you've said above, the start from the 10,000 range might be for factory purposes to signify a transition to certain specification changes and doesn't mean that 10,000 HS30's were produced.

 

Hope I haven't confused matters further.

 

 

[gilltech]

Yes it's all rather confusing.

And there were differences between Australia-spec-new & NZ-new cars so they would have to have been delivered in respective batches.

Many years ago when I was a Z-club member in NZ it seemed that every other 2+2 I looked at had come in from Australia (privately imported by a returning expat), typically being fitted with A/C & smog pipework & most often an automatic.

So maybe the 600 quoted for the RS30 2-seat is about right, & all the rest sold in Australia were 2+2s?

 

I know with old Mustangs that often the limited edition versions were produced in sufficient numbers so that every dealer in the USA & Canada could have at least one if they wanted, so there'd be at least 4,000 or so.....So how many Datsun dealerships were there in Australia in the 1970s? Each one would have wanted a Z in their showroom as a flagship model while they flogged off 120Ys & 180Bs you'd think.

 

[SPT260]

Mine is RS30 000797. Build date 05/74. Complied 10/74

Edited August 7, 2016 by SPT260

[Enzo]

For the record: 260z sport 2 seater -7/76  RS30-010258.

[Bonkers]

Like Enzo mine is RS30-005226 260Z sport 9/75.

I have had this car for some 27 years and others to keep it company . But before that early girl 000046 for some 8 years .But I must admit, I have found the 260 to be a better car over the 240 and the changes Nissan made to the model have fixed some of its basic problems. Especially the roof where it joins its supports . Early girls just seem to flex a lot at these points. Not so much the 260 2 seat.      

[Reddog]

Just out of interest I noticed the post from 'boyblunda'- 

 

"Before the issue arises again, there was a new 260Z model in 1976 starting from RS30 015001" 

 

This intrigued me so I checked and I have RS30 015011 built 10/1976 (Red 110, manual) and sold June 1977, Victoria.

 

Someone mentioned in an earlier forum regarding late model 260Z's that they had read somewhere that only 96 '77 260Z Coupe's were brought in for the Oz market?

Recently I was looking at photo's of a 03/1978 build UK 260Z and noticed that it had the older 260 (74-76) 'flat' horn pad which was a bit unusual as all of the other 77/78 original 260's (and 280's) I have seen have the newer 'deep' horn pad. This UK car had been put away by a collector for the past 27 years and only had approx. 8,500 miles on the clock and was passed in at auction...if I remember correctly they were after 26,000 Pounds Stirling for the car. Lot's of underbody component(s) 'surface' rust as well as some in and around the engine bay, but 'appears' to be a very original undamaged/unmolested car.

 

Cheers,

 

Rod.

 

• Like This

 

[SPT260]

Mine is 0000797.

[600Z]

From whatnot I could grind with some digging on numbers of cars that came to Australia and have found the following.

 

240Z's : 2358

260Z's : 1123

 

These are 2 seater versions of the 260Z's

 

Not sure how accurate it is but it's what I found. I'm sure others might have better numbers.

 

Justin

[AndBir]

Alan, thankyou for the above input. I very much appreciate the clear, patient, objective contributions you make to these discussions - they certainly add to my education.

 

So I went back to one of my previous references and found that indeed, I had not read it properly. The body differences made in the construction of the new 260Z model that I thought were differences between the 240Z and the 260Z were, according to Service Bulletin Vol.215 Modification Of Datsun 260Z Model S30 Series 1974 applied to new models starting with RS30 005001.

..../.....

 

Perhaps this early revision of the newly introduced 260Z is that which contributes to the thinking about the possible weight differences between 260Z models.

 

This is a little off track from the original topic but it does give an example of Alan's warning about being aware of the gaps that might appear in the numbers.

 

(Add Edit) If we look at the WAZ Register we can see that there were 15 RS30 260Z's with numbers ranging between RS30 000458 and RS30 1057 but the next number in sequence is RS30 005166. The build dates lodged for these vehicles are, only loosely sequential.

 

Before the issue arises again, there was a new 260Z model in 1976 starting from RS30 015001.

 

Just picked up the Service Bulletin Vol.197 Modification Of Datsun 260Z Model S30 Series 1973 off eBay.

Thought it may be an interesting read.