Jump to content
d3c0y

Classic car bubble

Recommended Posts

If you get a chance , drive a R32 GTR, so nice to drive. Surely these will be Classics.

Absolutely, the challenge is finding an honest one.

IIRC the Aus delivered ones are already well and truly "collectable"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow an R100 just isn't worth anything like that to me. I was already struggling with the RX3 coupe for $35k!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow an R100 just isn't worth anything like that to me. I was already struggling with the RX3 coupe for $35k!

 

So for me I see 2 sides of this.

 

I tend to agree it's a bit outrageous, but on the other hand I think the market they are trying to appeal to is not an Australian market. Rather they might be trying to appeal to a foreign collector where the depreciating $AUD is making these cars cheaper in their eyes. A collector in Japan might just pay the asking price for an original R100 coupe.

 

These are very rare now, especially because so many were abused and turned into fully hectic drag cars, how many original ones are left?

 

The Mazda Cosmo is probably also pulling values up since they have hit the $250,000 USD mark recently and others may be looking for other early rotary's are pinnacle cars and more so as an investment than anything else.

 

You have to remember about 10 years ago when a Toyota 2000GT came onto the market in Australia priced at $350,000 AUD people were saying it was ridiculous and over-priced also. Time has proved they were wrong.

 

Will it be the same for these? Hard to tell.. you can still get a lot of cool classic cars around the $30,000 range. I've always liked the early rotary coupe's - especially when they were cheap. Funny enough I've always hated the way most were modified though.

 

Either way it does make S30z's look cheap right now...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now I'm not picking on the Mazda R100's because I like them, but when did they exceed the $100K AUD mark?

 

http://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/Mazda-R100-1969/SSE-AD-3560112/?Cr=0

$115K

 

I sold a mint red R100 in the 90's for about $6 k and I thought I did well

Could even be the one above?  :

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

...Is it in an upcoming version or has it already aired?

...Doesn't look like they have covered a 240z yet.

 

The episode was on SBS Sydney tonight at 7:30pm - I missed it, but used Peter's link to watch it on the "SBS on demand" website.

(You can skip through the show - but it seems that you have to sit through all the ads up to the point you want to see before you can view it.)

 

At the 33:20 mark the presenter, Quentin Willson, talks about "some future classics that might make you some money". The cars he nominates are:

  • the Renault Clio Williams 1
  • the Datsun 240Z
  • the Jeep CJ.

 post-101663-0-10375800-1441371905_thumb.jpg

 

Here is what he says about the 240Z:

 

"Datsun 240Z which we know is a sports car but it was the best looking sports car ever to come out of Japan, and it outsold the E-type Jaguar. Now performance, respectable, 125 miles an hour, 0 to 60, 8 seconds, but it has become a really, really cool icon, which is why prices have gone up steadily.

There was a time when you'd be able to pick one up for £10,000, now a really nice 240Z is £25,000 and rising. You should get a 71, 72 manual, and you should get it from America where you've got a dry state. They look absolutely wonderful period, they're great for historic racing, and my bet is they're going to go past fifty grand one day."

Edited by GongZ

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Funny how in such a short segment, he says get a 71 / 72 ignoring the 69 / 70 build cars. Which are arguably the most collectible. Then it lists prices in Japan of a "Datsun 240z" when there was no such thing. So what is that monetary figure applied to?

 

When he says 50 grand what currency is he talking about? USD, AUD? I assume USD because it was probably filmed a while ago. They have already exceeded that figure anyway, depending on the market and specification of car. If you consider HS30-H and PS30 etc.. then they totally eclipse that figure anyway..

 

Good that they (S30z's) are getting more and more recognition but calling it the most beautiful Japanese car (and I would somewhat agree in my biased view) ignores other great shapes like the Toyota 2000GT the FD RX-7 (my opinion), NSX, R32 GTR etc..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Funny how in such a short segment, he says get a 71 / 72 ignoring the 69 / 70 build cars. Which are arguably the most collectible. Then it lists prices in Japan of a "Datsun 240z" when there was no such thing. So what is that monetary figure applied to?

 

When he says 50 grand what currency is he talking about? USD, AUD? I assume USD because it was probably filmed a while ago. They have already exceeded that figure anyway, depending on the market and specification of car. If you consider HS30-H and PS30 etc.. then they totally eclipse that figure anyway..

 

Good that they (S30z's) are getting more and more recognition but calling it the most beautiful Japanese car (and I would somewhat agree in my biased view) ignores other great shapes like the Toyota 2000GT the FD RX-7 (my opinion), NSX, R32 GTR etc..

 

I don't think many would argue that the 'early girls' are not more valuable - I have seen plenty of evidence of that in the Australian and US markets lately. (71's have been selling for top dollar on the first day of being advertised, while Matt Drago's 73 has had an extremely well executed and documented restoration and has been on the market for months.)

 

Maybe the presenter isn't aware of the existence of the earlier cars, and what he is really saying is that the 71 and 72 are more collectible than the 73?

 

The show was made earlier this year. All the values he talks about are in British pounds and in the British car market. In the screen shot attached to my post, it shows the then current approximate conversions of GBP £25,000 to US $40,000, €31,000, ¥430,000 and AU $45,000 - they are not supposed to be the value of S30's in foreign (to the UK) markets.

 

His prediction is that "they're going to go past fifty grand one day" = GBP £50,000 (AU $109,400 at today's rate). He does not give that a time frame however, so you can't argue with it - because one day within the next 5 to 300 years good examples probably will sell for that much. (Suitable fuel may be difficult to find though  ??? )

 

As for the 240Z being "the best looking sports car ever to come out of Japan" - its subjective (beauty is the eye of the ... blah,blah,blah)

mO6dTv3gPEOQK6QyyUZ-Dww.jpg

Edited by GongZ

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Australian import to UK orange 240z price dropped again to £19.9k

I guess car enthusiast only pay top dollars for matching numbers cars.. Another 240z V8 (rhd) asking £12k no takers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When he says 50 grand what currency is he talking about? 

 

GBP. GB Pounds.

 

These sort of program they have about 30 seconds for this sort of segment so they tend to gloss over things. So not all things said are 100% accurate or objective

 

But we will forgive them for that ;)

 

At least there are programs like this talking about these old car .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I find it interesting that the US and UK markets seem oblivious to whether a car is RHD or LHD. It doesn't even rate a mention in this article.

Edited by GongZ

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

well guys been reading about this classic car bubble and comments how it will burst when the old farts pass away that remember them as youngsters.

 

what we are forgeting there is a massive following on all classic cars from any age.

 

i dont remember the mid 60s or even 70s ( didnt even see the outside world till 77) . But loved the early Stangs as far as i can remember (1984 onwards) so as Trans Am Corvettes, porsches ferraries lambos etc.. ( do remember my old man stories when he had rx3 rx4 , xw, xy,xa and xb gt, chargers etc... i sure do not recall 240z or even 260z but do remeber s2 rx7 and 280zx 300zx etc..

 

theres teenagers now that lust for 240z. they cant afford them now but in 10-15 years time while they cash up they be paying 60-70k for one without even thinking. bubble wont burst just get bigger.

 

so dont worry about the bubble. unless there is a world war it will drop but than will go skyrocket again

 

so keep saving and enjoying the classics. demand is always there just stock is variable.

 

 

As for r32 gtr they are simple compared to todays cars. they are as unrealiable as the previous dodgey owner.

cheap neglected cars need work. dont want to do it buy the one for 3 times the price and enjoy.

Edited by Fairlady Z

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

well just took the s130 for a drive. just infront of me loud 1990 merc convertible 500SL

 

passing a bus stop and school kids totaly ignored the once flagship of Mercedes and stared at a humble red 280zx with jaws on the ground.

 

bubble wont burst people. z and well known popular classic will never drop new generations take over where previous one left off.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

perfect logic but the arse dramatically fell out of Australian classics after the gfc........... i think these skyrocketed for the exact reasons you describe but  have never recovered to what they were....... gt falcons particularly.....definitely as there is no international market or recognition also...... beauty of datsuns is they have only just started the value climb and with the import scene taking over the muscle car market the 'original jap muscle/hero cars' will have a fairly long and steady growth for many many years to come. And as much as i hate to admit it we largley have vin diesel, paul walker and playstation to thank for cementing our investments haha

Edited by 74zzz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like any asset bubble they end when they run out of greater fools willing to pay more than the last person did.

 

Tulip Mania

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulip_mania

 

But do I think S30z's are over-priced? Not yet.. although there is certainly a lot of hype around Japanese Classics at the moment perhaps due to years of neglect but at the same time like any asset there is an upper ceiling to where prices can go. Relatively speaking there is still a lot of S30z's around thanks to the large numbers sold in the North American markets over the years.

 

If we took the cars from the US out of the equation and assumed the worldwide supply of S30z's was what's left in Japan, the UK, Australia etc.. That would have put a lot of upward pressure on 240z prices a long time ago. But quite a few (albeit very rough examples) still survive in North America. Of course the number of people wanting 1 has been increasing and since they are not making anymore that's meant even average ones have been steadily rising in price.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My penny's worth (or should I say half a crown's worth given price hike)...

 

Demand is being fuelled by poor returns from equities, a clamp down on what you can put away into private pensions, release of funds from private pensions (since April 15 in UK), the fact that capital gain from private use cars is exempt from CGT (certainly in the UK) and a 40-60 age group who want to relive their teens and buy cars like the 240z, Golf gti mk1, E-type, Elan, 911, Healey.

 

I personally don't see it as a bubble. The above factors are real and will be present as a demand push for some time yet. Until these factors change, I can't see a slow down in classic car prices.

 

I have made significant capital on my car collection - and will continue to add to the collection. I'm aware of risks - but I think they are small and manageable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×