260DET

Win Percy, who we know as a top pro driver, compared the handling of the S30 he drove with that of the Porsche factory 944 which itself was a superb handling car. Praise indeed. Of course it all depends on the individual S30's setup and tuning but we know that the potential is there ready to be used.

Reading up on the S30 racing years, interesting to see comments by the US drivers who went to the S30 after racing the Fairlady sports and how much better the S30 drove and handled than the sporty. Crude suspension performance and general handling saved by a powerful engine which was used to drive the car dirt track style. Win Percy also drove a S30, one of the best handling cars around according to him. So properly setup and tuned suspension seems to be another potential advantage that the Zed has, compared with it's rivals. HTH

As far as starting the process of contacting the right person at Nissan, Japan, a chap from Nissan Australia was involved in NDN15. He even attended the dinner and spoke there. There was an opportunity lost, he is keen and seems like the right person who could start the process.

Let's keep this thread on brakes please Jason, your 'eligible parts' thread is right below.

Yep, Jason can start an aero thread

Good to see some positive comment particularly concerning brake management, to provoke constructive discussion was the whole idea of this thread StopTech in the US sell S30 front rotors and their gear is good, while on the subject of the US I'm fairly sure that the well known early racing successes of the S30 there included the SCCA C/production class which if I'm right was allowed some engine but no brake upgrades. And now moving to the subject of upgrades, it may be said that we are fortunate in being allowed to use the current front and rear aero, as far as I'm aware the front spoiler was never a production item.

This should not be a pissing match Jason, it's intended to provoke constructive responses and to get a bit of thought going. I'm not the one claiming that because of inadequate brakes the S30 is uniquely handicapped when it seems pretty obvious that all Sc cars would have to face the same problem. But if you want to get personal then I'll fire just one point back, one out of many. Brake pads. Obviously it's nonsense to claim in effect that there are no suitable pads available. Utter nonsense.

Over 600 views but little conversation, just about finished anyway Wheels. Obviously are relevant to brake cooling so throw those awful Performance Heavyweight's into the bin and get serious. It may well be that some wheels would act as a fan for the brakes but that's beyond my knowledge so let's just look at the design of the usual Watanabe style and start with the proposition that the more open the design the better. Those less well known come from Enkei and Konig, Enkei always make a good light wheel while the Konig Rewind is a very open design, pic below. And finally onto the touchy subject of driving. I'll just leave the quote below from a driver who raced a standard braked S30 and say nothing. "You just have to drive while being easy on the brakes. On hard and then off for short intervals Don't drag the brakes, no trail braking, left foot brake, and learn how to carry more speed through the corners. Move roll stiffness to the back of the car so it rotates more and gives better control with the throttle. Install the front brake backng plates from a early car or run no front backing plates. Hawk blues have worked well for me. Most important, take weight out of the car and make sure the rear drums are adjusted tight." Another quote. "You will need to balance your braking agressivness with trying to get about 2 hours of life out of pads. You would be surprised what lap times you can get by rolling on and rolling off the pedal. Solid, consistent, threshold braking will only gain a .1 or .2 seconds on most turns and is usually the last thing a pro driver tries to squeeze out. From turn in to apex is where the magic happens."

When I first decided to get into old car motorsport I bought a book with details of every car made during the particular time. Then went through each one looking for what seemed the best platform. At the end it boiled down to two cars, the S30 and the 911. The 911 was then ruled out as being poor value for money with expensive spares and inferior suspension and overall upgrade potential. I still think that is the situation today.

While the figures are to hand, Project Mu make an off the shelf brake pad with an operating temp up to 980*c. Cast iron has a melting point of ~1150*c. And what about ceramic coated rotors? Anyone tried them? EDIT: And if you want to nearly melt the rotors how about Carbotech XP20 compound which is effective up to 1093*c.

Agree 100% Gavin, the 'poor man's' thing is probably the product of a vivid imagination but it's all nonsense. If the S30 had been made in limited numbers and priced high then it would not be thought of as the poor man's anything. Assuming that the extra price included proper rust proofing

Seems to me that everyone in Sc would have to battle brake heat problems, not only S30's, and of course bigger brakes would be better. But you have what you have so optimising them is the go, which could involve several minor tweaks that add up to a significant improvement. What temps were your brakes getting up to Matt? As I mentioned before, a good way to sort out pad problems is to go to a specialist knowing what temps are involved. Pagid for one have heaps of data available on the relative strengths and weaknesses of their various compounds, a informed choice could be made just using that info. I don't accept that it's not possible to get a pad to handle the heat, it may rip the hell out of the rotors but hey, that's part of racing old cars isn't it?

Here we go again Anyway, what actual temps do the rotors/calipers reach Jason? That would be the starting point for selecting pads because there would be proper racing brake pads available that would work. They may have to be specially made to suit but they would be available. Maybe I should have gone the Sc route myself, love these sorts of challenges. EDIT: A quick search shows that Hawk make a full range of proper racing pads for the S30 including their Blue 90210 and the SCCA favourite the DTC-70. Have you tried these Jason? EDIT 2: And here is a gadget that facilitates brake fluid circulation in real time.

Bend/cut the stock shields/backing plates to form air scoops/extractors? Heat should really not be a unsurmountable problem as far as brake fluid and pads/linings go, rotors will crack/craze if not warmed up before hard use. Pads are really important in that some are better than others in removing heat from rotors, use poor heat conducting hydraulic pistons and special shims to reduce the amount of heat being transferred to the brake fluid, aluminium pistons are bad like that And so on..................

There are quite a few tricks that can be used to cool brakes down if that is the main problem, I understand that only stock spec parts can be used except for lining materials so I was wondering what cooling tricks were allowed and used eg drilling holes in backing plates, using slotted rotors and so on. Saw something different the other day, basically a extended shim which sits behind the disc pads and is shaped to offer some surface area to the airflow. Every bit helps. I suspect that Adler and co don't just rely on bare factory parts, some of those euro blokes put a lot of work and thinking into their cars. It's not all about money which I think can be used as an excuse by others some times.

OK, so they overheat, what then has been done to counter that, front and rear. Had a brief chat with Switzer yesterday, apparently the Zed's head gasket was leaking but he was going to push on. Don't know what happned to Mike, he was gone early arvo today. Adler in his Porker two bloody seconds clear of everyone, WTF were the rest of them doing

So specifically, what are these problems and what has been done to improve the stock S30 brakes for racing? And what rules are relevant as to what can and can't be done regarding the stock brakes, I guess that F1 style carbon fibre rotors would not be allowed for a start.

All back to business as usual this arvo, never seen so many race cars at MP, the place is packed. One thing I did notice is that the P cars were in the handy good concrete floor garages while the Datsuns were down the back in the muddy part. Hmmmm.

Should be able to get out to MP after lunch. No cars using the track at present, I heard them a bit yesterday during breaks in the rain so no doubt that at least the track is covered with debris.

Nasty storm hit Warwick last night, trees down everywhere so I hope those out at MP are OK. Would go out to check but have a tradie doing work here at home.

It's serious, for your average punter who has no delusions of being a pro. Extra weight is the negative which is for an amateur compensated to some degree by it being central and low weight. Then there is the plus which for me, hopefully, enables more concentration on driving the car fast and safely. And to me that's what it's all about, anything that is problematical and which interferes with that process is a negative which should be eliminated, if possible.

So what exactly does the KEW twin idler set do that the standard setup doesn't? From a performance, reliability and durability aspect.

Apparently the headers will have to be rerouted and so on, this after taking a lot of time and trouble to get them right originally. ZX seems to have less engine bay/trans tunnel space than a S30.

The story continues. ZX is all ready to go in manual form, drive by wire and all. Waiting to get a dyno tune now. But there's more. Auto guru is back and preparing the 4L80E factory special 640 hp capable transmission which will include dyno tuning the electronics so everything works how it's supposed to, all before it goes into the car. That should be finished next week so if the planets align it will be sent to AM for fitting, which could be interesting as the ZX was never designed to take a big auto like that. Something to note on using this auto on a racetrack, the selected torque converter incorporates a tripple plate lockup clutch which the electronics will lock and unlock when appropriate. Given that the engine has a 3000+ rpm usable power band the clutch will be locked most of the time when accelerating so in effect the auto will then be acting like a manual transmission.

Without the supercharger power though PS Whoever bashed those headers needs surgical attention to his family jewels