2013 Nissan Datsun Nationals

[sco_aus]

So where do we find the entry for the sprints at?  They said they would be out soon, but I haven't seen it yet.

[Riceburner]

NDSOC are pleased to announce that Phillip Island will play host to the 2013 Nissan Datsun Nationals on March 29th to 31st, 2013. The Island and its surrounds areas have much to offer and with many different types of accommodation, something can be found for all entrants.

 

The schedule is;

 

Friday March 29th

2-5pm - Registration/Check-in Bass Rooms, Ramada Resort Phillip Island, 2128 Phillip Island Road, Phillip Island. Come and grab your Nationals pack and say hello, gather any additional information before heading to your accommodation to unpack and unwind.

 

6:30pm - Welcome barbeque, Bass Rooms, Ramada Resort Phillip Island. Here you get to catch up with faces from Goulburn in 2011 or meet many new ones in a relaxed atmosphere.

 

Saturday March 30th

7am -5pm - Nationals Sprint and Regularity, Phillip Island Grand Prix Circuit. Arguably one of the nation’s fastest and most respected tracks, the day will be spent with fellow Nissan / Datsun’s stretching their legs. There will be a regularity class for those who want to be part of the event but not put too much strain on their car, however places are limited for this class.

Dorian timing devices will be used & is included in your entry cost.

There will be a familiarisation session for your first run out on the track.

You will need a CAMS Level 2S licence as a minimum and must be a member of a CAMS affiliated club to compete.

Please note the day is a 75dba day.

There will also be a professional photographer there to capture you in action.

 

Or

 

Country Drive through Phillip Island and surrounding areas. For those who want to explore the regions along some amazing roads, then this drive is for you. There will be navigational directions, questions to answer which will keep everyone occupied on the trip with prizes awarded at the presentation dinner.

 

Sunday March 31st

9am-3pm - Concours / Show and Shine , The Esplanade, Cowes. The day many have been waiting for. Held along the Esplanade against a glorious backdrop, here you will find some amazing vehicles. Cars will be in place from approx 9:30 -3pm. Please note you cannot move your vehicle during this time.

There will be a shuttle bus, which will run from 10:00 am until 3:00 pm so that you can visit some of the attractions in the surrounding areas.

 

6:30pm - Presentation Dinner Continental Hotel, the Esplanade, Cowes. Re-live the weekends events and cheer the award winners from the Track day, Concours, Show and Shine, Drive and much more. There will be raffles, giveaways and a fabulous night is ensured. Find out who is the recipient of the Robert Shannon Memorial Award, (Z Nationals Champion) and the 2013 Nationals Champion.

For all enquiries, please contact nationals@ndsoc.com.au

 

Entry Forms:

http://www.ndsoc.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/2013-Nationals-Official-Entry.pdf

 

Track day supp regs uploaded shortly.

[sco_aus]

No no, thanks but I mean the actual sprint entry, I was told by the lady taking the entries that a sprint entry would be announced soon.  I have already entered and paid for everything, but I assumed that 260DET was talking about the sprint entry.

[Riceburner]

The supp regs for the sprint are still to come out, but it'll be just like any other track day. As far as sprint entry goes, all you need to do is submit that entry form and pay.

[sco_aus]

Ok thanks, I have only done one before at the last nats, so I don't have much experience with it all and want to make sure I get it right.  Thanks mate

[260DET]

One day CAMS licences? Can't see any reference to licences in the Sup Regs and CAMS require one day licence forms to be supplied by the event organiser. $100 for a one year CAMS licence when AASA charge $55, no thanks.

[PZG302]

One day CAMS licences? Can't see any reference to licences in the Sup Regs and CAMS require one day licence forms to be supplied by the event organiser. $100 for a one year CAMS licence when AASA charge $55, no thanks.

 

But Richard that 2s CAMS licence will then let you run at great places like Noosa Hillclimb, choice of two per year, Mt Cotton Hill climb,quite a few events like the Tighe series and Qld Chamionship, a plethora of sprints like Gatton, Leyburn and Lowood as well as Maryborough, and also sprints at Morgan Park, Hill Climbs at Grafton, and that's without looking up the CAMS website, oh and the CAMS insurance for competitors is much better than AASA if something does go wrong on the track and you are injured, as wella s pit crew being covered.

 

And with the amount of money it's costing to get to Phillip Island, really what an extra $100 in the scheme of things......

[sco_aus]

I have pulled out sadly, won't get to do another one either

[pauly_adams]

still havnt got the engine sorted yet mate, that's sad to hear you wont make it but your not the only one, my wedding is whats stopping me

[sco_aus]

Nah, even if I do, I have decided to sell it.  I might get one later.  That's a fair excuse mate lol

[260DET]

But Richard that 2s CAMS licence will then let you run at great places like Noosa Hillclimb, choice of two per year, Mt Cotton Hill climb,quite a few events like the Tighe series and Qld Chamionship, a plethora of sprints like Gatton, Leyburn and Lowood as well as Maryborough, and also sprints at Morgan Park, Hill Climbs at Grafton, and that's without looking up the CAMS website, oh and the CAMS insurance for competitors is much better than AASA if something does go wrong on the track and you are injured, as wella s pit crew being covered.

 

And with the amount of money it's costing to get to Phillip Island, really what an extra $100 in the scheme of things......

 

It's a matter of principle mate, there is no CAMS event in Q where 5th gear can be used and that is my entry test. Maybe at Morgan Park but not sure what non series events they are putting on this year.

 

So does the silence mean that one day licences are not on the agenda?

[Riceburner]

After some advice as it's been a few years since I have raced. I notice in the supp regs it mentions 'supplementary return springs for each throttle'. I have six FCR carbs which to me means six throttles, but they are all coupled to a single throttle shaft via threaded metal inserts and have a single throttle cable. All linkages are inside the carb bodies, leaving only a solid shaft and throttle cable wheel on the outside that I can attach to.

 

The carbs have a single return spring fitted from the factory, it's heavy gauge and quite difficult to operate by hand. I have two of these fitted to the current setup so the 'supplementary return spring' would give me three springs in total.

 

Do I just hook up the extra return spring on the throttle wheel and hope that it's enough?

 

[1600dave]

My take on this is that the intention of the regulation is to ensure you have two independant means of closing ALL throttles so that if one thing fails, the other can still return the car to idle and prevent a jammed-open throttle situation. In my case running twin SU's, just two springs (one on each carb) always gets me through scrutineering, I've never had to fit two springs to each carb. In your case, you seem to have two springs operating on a single throttle shaft - if just one of these springs will return all 6 carbs to closed, it should be right,

 

I've had one scrutineer query mine a few years back, I demonstrated by disconnecting each spring one at a time, the car returned to idle with just one spring and the scrut was happy.

 

Having said that, I always carry a stash of very lightweight springs that I can throw on in an emergency, you never know how they are going to interpret the regulations 

[dat2kman]

As a scrutineer i prefer to see two independant springs, that will enable the return to closed of throttle plate.

 

Some will contend that there are two mousetrap springs per Weber carb, yes, when new, but what about ability to visually inspect, you cant! So, yes, two external springs.

 

SU type carbs have small springs tucked under, again hard to see, if tangs or spring ends are broken/missing.

 

Recently in Qld, we had a competitor pass away post a track incident.

His engine was heard at high rpm, his front brakes were observed locked on, he speared off track, at speed into a fende. His neck was broken, and cardiac arrest ensue.

This matter is now under investigation. The car was fitted with twin sidedfaft type carbs.

 

Just fit a cou two obvious springs, independant of whatever is inside your carbs/induction, with some working ability, to keep all happy !

[Riceburner]

Thanks guys. So I'll add two external springs from the throttle wheel back to the valve cover, hopefully that should be enough to get me through. I'll take some spares along too.

[Gordo]

Now they are talking about rollcage padding, can anyone shed some light on this. New material ?

[luvemfast]

Now they are talking about rollcage padding, can anyone shed some light on this. New material ?

The email stated that pool padding will not be acceptable.

Without going into specifics. They advise to get the proper padding from a motorsport supplier.

[DAZDA]

Now they are talking about rollcage padding, can anyone shed some light on this. New material ?

http://www.camsmanual.com.au/pdf/10_gen_req/GQ11_Schedule_J_2013-5.pdf

 

Section 11 (Page 7)

 

11. PROTECTIVE PADDING

11.1 Helmet and Head Protection:

(a) Where the helmet of an occupant could come into contact with the safety cage, protective padding shall be

fitted in that area, which complies with:

(i) International competition and below, FIA standard 8857-2001, type A (see FIA Technical List No 23 “Roll

Cage Padding Homologated by the FIA”); or

(ii) For national competitions and lower, SFI specification 45.1. For each 1st Category vehicle manufactured

prior to 1 January 2012, the use of SFI specification 45.2 for the head rest is permitted.

(b) Implementation Dates

Padding of the type specified in 11.1(a) is required as follows:

• Any FIA category vehicle (eg, Group N, Super 2000) – refer FIA Appendix J, Article 253 – currently in place;

• National competitions – from 1 January 2012; and

• All competitions – from 1 January 2013.The use of the specified padding is highly recommended in the meantime.

 

 

 

Most places like Revolution RaceGear should sell it.

http://www.revolutionracegear.com.au/index.php?PSO=245&PSID=360078001&PSV=Primary&EGPUID=103710

[DAZDA]

There are road and race categories.

If your car;

  has a cage of any kind

  has slicks

  has a gutted interior

  is heavily modified

  has a logbook

  is unregistered

then you will be in race.

 

Road is for cars that are relatively roadworthy, have only a couple modifications such as mag wheels/minor brake changes and are not heavily modified.

 

How are people interpretting this?  Even if you don't have a roll cage, I would have thought anyone running a non-Lseries engine or a race style L-series (PMC engine for example) would have to be in the 'Race cars' catagory?

 

[luvemfast]

How are people interpretting this?  Even if you don't have a roll cage, I would have thought anyone running a non-Lseries engine or a race style L-series (PMC engine for example) would have to be in the 'Race cars' catagory?

PMC is just an L series!

[DAZDA]

PMC is just an L series!

I know - I'm not an idiot.  I said "Race Style".

 

So youre saying a PMC L-series with individual throttle bodes (Webers, injection, whatever), electronic ignition, big cam, heavily modified, with 300hp+ should be in the same group as a ~100hp from factory (points ignition, Twin SU style, stock engine) L-series?

 

If so, that's fine.  I just want to be sure what people think is the interpretation of this is...

[dat2kman]

Hmm, ,,, car complies to CAMS category Group S.

Production sports car, limited modifications permitted, and safety modifications for competition purposes. Can be registered, or un registered.

Running on treaded approved for public road tyres.

 

If "Race" then does it put it in same league as a full house group 2B marque sports rule modded Z?

 

Re the roll cage padding, most of the rules as quoted/excerpted above, are relevant to Rally, and FIA rally, however it is filtering in amongst other disciplines.

 

A scrutineer, depending on how pedantic they are, should be content with some padding, be it plumbers black split pipe insulation ( good life) or the horrid pool tube toy stuff( poor life)

 

Where to put it?

Imagine you are in a car in an accident, rolling multiple, your belts are very tight, but they will stretch, your skeletal mass will elongate, your arms and legs flail about, your neck experiences multiple plane movement, belt stretch aporox 100 mm, nexk stretch approx 25 mm.

Put the padding anywhere that remotely looks like you may come into contact.

 

Check first prior to event, explaining that the event is a Supersprint, what are padding requirements.

FWIW

[Riceburner]

I went in race class  LOL. I took it to mean that unless the car was basically stock then u would be put in race class anyway

[Gordo]

+1 Gareth, I think if you are modified beyond a reasonably stock car looks like you will be in race. The main reason is we are missing the modified class, the one in the middle . This is to cut down on the classes, otherwise there would be three classes in every category .

[1600dave]

11. PROTECTIVE PADDING

11.1 Helmet and Head Protection:

(a) Where the helmet of an occupant could come into contact with the safety cage, protective padding shall be

fitted in that area, which complies with:

(i) International competition and below, FIA standard 8857-2001, type A (see FIA Technical List No 23 “Roll

Cage Padding Homologated by the FIA”); or

(ii) For national competitions and lower, SFI specification 45.1. For each 1st Category vehicle manufactured

prior to 1 January 2012, the use of SFI specification 45.2 for the head rest is permitted.

(b) Implementation Dates

Padding of the type specified in 11.1(a) is required as follows:

• Any FIA category vehicle (eg, Group N, Super 2000) – refer FIA Appendix J, Article 253 – currently in place;

• National competitions – from 1 January 2012; and

• All competitions – from 1 January 2013.The use of the specified padding is highly recommended in the meantime.

 

I took it to be that even humble supersprints require the new padding from 1st Jan this year.

 

The FIA / SFI stuff is very dense, I recently replaced my old aircon ducting insulation with the SFI-rated stuff wherever my helmet may contact the cage in an accident, but have gone with the softer (and cheaper) fire-retardant pool noodle-type stuff (still from a motorsport shop though, just looks more like the pool noodle material) wherever arms / legs / etc may come in contact with the cage. Personally, I reckon the SFI / FIA stuff is a little too dense / hard / unforgiving for areas where human flesh may contact the cage. Good for helmets, not so much for my softer appendages.

 

EDIT:

 

Just read the full link from the cAMS manual posted above, this paragraph

 

11.2 Body Protection: Where the body of an occupant could come into contact with the safety cage, it is

recommended that flame retardant padding be fitted. FIA standard 8857-2001 or SFI specification 45.1

padding.

 

Makes me think my "softer" padding may not be OK, might have to have the denser FIA / SFI stuff everywhere ?

 

I'm using this stuff in areas that my body (but not helmet) may contact the cage.

 

http://www.revolutionracegear.com.au/index.php?PCID=18358&PSO=245&PSID=310000008_&PSV=Primary&CDO=

 

EDIT EDIT:

 

The word "recommended" now leads me to think I may be OK with the softer stuff (or even no stuff)

 

Might be time to ring CAMS to confirm........