Lynton Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 At the end of the day Zeds are a commodity just like Art, Real Estate or other Cars in the end it is all a matter of a personal opinion...........end of subject! Lynton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzzzed Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 At the end of the day Zeds are a commodity just like Art, Real Estate or other Cars in the end it is all a matter of a personal opinion...........end of subject! Lynton best post of the tred Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
260DET Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Yeh I cop crap all the time about my 280ZX but then give back plenty too. But it's all fun as far as I'm concerned but some people have forgotten the art of the piss take and take it all emo personally Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvemfast Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Who is Past member? Shame that you'd step back into the darkness after 1000+ posts and change your username. Then get upset about something like this? Not having a go. Just curious I'm certainly not feeling ostracized on this forum just because I drive a 280ZX. The basis of this thread is to discuss the differences, opinions, pros and cons between the early generation Z's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Camouflage Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Past Member is/was galderdi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvemfast Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Past Member is/was galderdi. Is this a piss take then or what? Have I been stooged again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benny Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Is this a piss take then or what? Have I been stooged again? its definitely galderadi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Camouflage Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Yep. I still had the old window open with his username against that post. If you think 280ZX owners cop a ribbing, try owning a Z31 - in the top 10 worst cars ever made according to Jeremy Clarkson. Datsun decided to fit a larger engine, and ruin it (the 260Z). Then they put an even bigger engine in there and ruined it even more (the 280ZX) and then they gave up with the idea of making sports cars and concentrated instead on trying to make the worlds nastiest car. Something they achieved with the 300ZX (Z31). After Nissan killed off its 240z they managed to get the whole idea of sports coupes entirely wrong for the next 12 years. The 260 was worse than its predecessor while the 280 was worse than anything that had gone before it. Including Ghengis Khan. But even it was not as bad as the first incarnation of the 300. Anyone that knows anything about cars should always put this in their top 10 worst cars of all time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
positivetennis Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 As one independent said in parliament last year,"Whatever does your biscuit! Yes its all about perspectives. Each model in the zed line has its advantages and disadvantages depending on so many factors which many of the posts here have highlighted. I've got that book by Jeremy Clarkson where he lists his favourite cars and even he has cars in there which are interesting to say the least, Pug 504 estate, A Ford Transit Van, and a Rover SD1. I'd rather a 280zx or z31 compared to those cars. Tony Davis has the 280zx in his Lemon Books. Also in SCW June 1974 there is an article which praises the 260z 2+2 styling over the 240z, including commenting on how much improved the handling and ride was over the previous model. I think you can debate this topic for as long as you like (I have), thats why I think we need to rate cars according to certain criterias and give acknowledgement to the timing of what was written. Things I liked in 1985, I may sometimes see them differently now. From a personal view one thing that originally attracted me to zeds was the exotic timeless style of the cars. There is something about a zed, 2000gt, E-type, Opel Gt, Daytona's Dino's and XK8's that have this classic beauty about them, (They are Art) even if their performance is not the best. For example a WRX, Evo, M3 are magnificant performance cars, but to me they look like two door sedans. A 2000gt has some fantasy and rommance about them. I wouldn't mind having one of each zed model in my garage in new condition. I am sure we could brainstorm and come up with positives and negatives of each model and get someone to summarise and post in a commonly asked questions about zeds". Back in 1986 the z31 turbo was quite an impressive car to own with all the features it had, it was the most expensive Japanese car in Australia, very upmarket at the time and the turbo had some urge. Even today, if you see a mint one going around it still looks elegant whereas many other 86 cars have dated. Just look at a 1987 Pintara/Skyline and you'll see. Yes many z31's would have quite a few kays, the turbo housing is probably cracked, the engine mounts slippping, and you'd be having to work very hard on changing that bastard temperature sensor unit or even spark plug number 5. However if your 2m tall you will think that this car is heaven compared to a 370z I tried to get comfortable in the other day. The 280zx is almost as roomy, easier to work on, has that elegant style, the seats will feel very soggy now, but the one touch power window a clever touch. Youll notice quite and improvement between a 79 and an 83 as far as driving feel, but all the same you'll wish it had more power, as your dads old VL will feel more sprightly. You'll feel good in your 240 and 260z as you stop at the lights and see the reflection of the car in the shop window and marvel at the styling. The seats though will feel very slim and the doors making you feel very close to that truck that just went passed you. You will enjoy the sound they make but not the fumes or rust, but love the idea that you have a classic in original concourse condition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kobes Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 Yeah, can understand how owning a 280z you would feel bit like an outcast in the zed world. When trying to join the Zed car club here in WA they only admit 240z / 260z, when i asked why not the 280z the answer was well you have to draw the line somewhere! Personally i think many laymen could not tell the difference bewteen the 240 260 280 zed series... it kinda pissed me of at the start how the 280z that obviously belonged to the family so could be considered such at outcast that it would not even be considered to become a member in a zed car club. Having said that have felt the opposite with other zed "no official" zed clubs... the 300zx club in western australia makes you feel at home as long as there is a Zed somewhere on the car or in ya garage... It still amazes me that alot of people try and dis-associate the 280z from the zed family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators gav240z Posted January 16, 2012 Administrators Share Posted January 16, 2012 Yeah, can understand how owning a 280z you would feel bit like an outcast in the zed world. When trying to join the Zed car club here in WA they only admit 240z / 260z, when i asked why not the 280z the answer was well you have to draw the line somewhere! Personally i think many laymen could not tell the difference bewteen the 240 260 280 zed series... it kinda pissed me of at the start how the 280z that obviously belonged to the family so could be considered such at outcast that it would not even be considered to become a member in a zed car club. Having said that have felt the opposite with other zed "no official" zed clubs... the 300zx club in western australia makes you feel at home as long as there is a Zed somewhere on the car or in ya garage... It still amazes me that alot of people try and dis-associate the 280z from the zed family. I haven't read all the recent comments but... A long time ago I was open to having the club incorporate the Z31 and Z32 also, but many members were concerned it would attract the "wrong type" of members. However as these cars age they do have a place in the classic car world and we should be open to change or we'll just become an old gentlemen's club of pipe smokers who bang on about how good the old 240z/260z was.... I'll catch up on some of the comments later when I'm not at work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dat2kman Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 The 280 Z is the same body shell as the 240Z and 260Z! It wasnt sold in Australia, but plenty sold in the US. Unless you are refferring to the ZX, which i suspect you are! Yeah, can understand how owning a 280z you would feel bit like an outcast in the zed world. When trying to join the Zed car club here in WA they only admit 240z / 260z, when i asked why not the 280z the answer was well you have to draw the line somewhere! Personally i think many laymen could not tell the difference bewteen the 240 260 280 zed series... it kinda pissed me of at the start how the 280z that obviously belonged to the family so could be considered such at outcast that it would not even be considered to become a member in a zed car club. Having said that have felt the opposite with other zed "no official" zed clubs... the 300zx club in western australia makes you feel at home as long as there is a Zed somewhere on the car or in ya garage... It still amazes me that alot of people try and dis-associate the 280z from the zed family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Camouflage Posted January 16, 2012 Share Posted January 16, 2012 It's not a Z car club as such, its a S30 club, for 240/260/280 S30 chassis cars. I believe one of the reasons for this was that the costs involved in running a club double once you pass a certain number of members, and I think they are close to the limit with just S30 owners. Including S130's owners would probably put them just over the limit and incur higher costs, which would mean higher club fees per member. As it is they can cater for the S30 owners with a small annual club fee, which gets you a CAMS licence for the motorsport events the club is involved in and covers public liability insurance. Though having said that, I'm not part of the club council, that's just my vague recollection of what was discussed when the club went "official". Do I agree with it? No, but if its the difference between having a club in which you get to go out on the track, or not having a club at all, then I'll support it. If they decide to allow 280zx's down the track I'll support that too. We still get 280ZX's turn up to the Z day. There was a nice looking 2 seater at the last one. A guy brought it over from the UK with him. I think S30's probably out number S130 in WA now. I feel bad for them when they are told they cant join. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators gav240z Posted January 16, 2012 Administrators Share Posted January 16, 2012 I would love to have the statistics on how many of these critical comments come from people who have never driven a 280zx in reasonable condition. The facts are it is a little heavier and it is less desirable. But they weigh a mere 1250KGs. Why is it that almost every other 6 cyl starts at 1400KGs yet the 280zx cops all the criticism. The answer of course is because it followed the light weight 240. I have said it before and I'll say it again. I have driven a few 240s and on the road I'd rather drive my 280zx any day (except race day). Don't forget this forum is for the S130 as well. So we have a choice, tone down the judgments or the forum will start losing fans of the s130 (me included). I for one am quite happy to find another forum if this one doesn't want S130 enthusiasts. Seriously I don't know what all the fuss is about here. We are sharing opinions and comments about what each model has to offer. I myself have only driven 1 280zx, it was a blue 2+2 which had been retrofitted with a carby turbo set up and it was not running very good. The suspension was shot (or at least it should have handled better than when I drove it), it felt like a bath tub. So I can't really say how good they are compared to a 240z / 260z since I don't think it's a fair comparison. I will say that the 2+2 styling, like all 2+2 coupes it seems are always a compromise in terms of looks. I much prefer the 2 seater and the turbo version must move very quick. The problem is I've seen so many run down tired cars I can't recall seeing a mint ZX in a long time. Do I think they are a bad car? Not really I think they were very good for the time, but I would definitely go for a early RX-7 instead if I was looking for a car like the 240z but 10-12 years newer. As a cruiser / comfortable ride to work then yeah I'd say they are great cars compared to the noisy, hard to drive 240z. The fuel injection is simple and the power steering along with interior comforts are nice for long drives. God knows I felt exhausted driving the 240z from Melbourne to Goulburn for the Z nationals in 2005 (god it's been that long). The again my 240z is damn loud and the fumes, well at enough speed they are ok but when the windows come down the fumes come in . There are pro's and con's to any of these cars and at the end of the day it should only matter how you feel about it. We don't spend money on cars expecting a return on investment so if it's your toy then you just enjoy it. Also for the record I've noticed more and more ZX members join up recently which I think can only be a good thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators gav240z Posted January 17, 2012 Administrators Share Posted January 17, 2012 Yep. I still had the old window open with his username against that post. If you think 280ZX owners cop a ribbing, try owning a Z31 - in the top 10 worst cars ever made according to Jeremy Clarkson. LOL, poor old Z31. I was too scared to even look at them given the complexity of their engine bay and the cost of components for them. Owning an RX-7 I imagine is a bit similar, so many people have a distaste for the rotary engine it's amazing how many people comment on how bad they are and how they blow up easily or need rebuilds all the time etc.. Frankly I'm amazed half the time because so many people have never owned 1 but act like experts talking about them. I was advised against getting an FD RX-7, but I think they are a superb car and I love it almost as much as the S30. I also enjoy learning more and more about the engines themselves and how they work. So I don't really get upset if people say you should replace the rotary with a V8 or try and put the car down saying they are unreliable etc.. I just get in and drive and think "wow this car is amazingly fast". I've also seen lots of negative comments about the RX-8 I feel for a similar reason the 280zx gets flammed because the car before it was seen as more performance oriented and all the purists get upset. I would love an RX-8 I think they look great, I used to not be too keen on the styling but over time it's really grown on me and I think they look like loads of fun. Now the RENESIS did have some reliability issues which were again revised in the later versions but it's sad to see people say so many negative things about them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynton Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I have owned, a Datsun 1600Sports Fairlady, Datsun 2000 Sports Fairlady, Datsun 260Z coupe, Datsun 260Z 2+2, Datsun 280ZX S1 & S2, two Nissan 300ZX Z31 S3 Californians, a Nissan 200SX R Spec. All these cars on a comparative basis as the years move on come under the same discussions and differences people were having years ago and we still having today I see that as kind of healthy. The cars in my opinion are all excellent cars for their time, main differences being improvements in design and suspension, engine technology, brakes, safety and creature comforts. Coupes (tin tops) and Sports cars (soft tops) ...as they were known in the old days .......their designs have been and look timeless over the years that have past, look at the first Porsche 911 and what we have today! The Lotus Elan and the Mazda MX5! These cars were aimed to sell in their sales market for their time and all of them were at their epitome when they were released for sale. The debates and argumentive reasons will continue about marques but all in all I have never had a moment of dissappointment or expectation that has not been delivered for all of the above cars, one must appreciate the vehicle and its purpose in the market place for which it is directed at. A Nissan 370Z is not a Porsche Cayman there is a reason for the price difference and each are aimed at differnt markets by the manufacturer. That doesn't mean you don't get bang for buck in the 370Z. Lynton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dat2kman Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I dont get it, why be elitist, and decree only this model can join, etc. They are all Z's, we all love and appreciate them! The Z car club in Qld doesnt discriminaye, and is not that elitist ( a few think the Pres is a bit odd!), they even accept the true original first ever Datsun Sports cars in their ranks, even though it hoses most of them off! To have clubs fracture, become one model specific, in the current day and age with rising costs, lack of cars left, etc, is a recipe for disintegration of a club. Old hairy chestnut here, but, what if the z car nats just stuck to one specific? The event would fold, or at minimum, just become a bit of a gathering in a motel carpark at a nice coastel town, where they all just lift bonnets, ,aybe go for a drive, as the cost of doing "more" is too high.. Better to embrace at minimum all Z, Zx, and new Z, or go further and accept all Nissan Datsun, god forbid! I look at NDSOC, strong, healthy, active, lots of varied membets, all encompassing, gets invites to plenty, runs plenty,, marvellous! Sure, pay homage to the S30 body, it is a succesfull point in time for a car manufacturer, and there are many worldwide in past, today, and no doubt future, that will revete this series of Z car. They are increasing in value, so if ypur thinking about getting one, do so, or thinking about selling, ,aybe re-asses and keep it. FWIW, there is only one S30 280Z in Australia, but plenty in the USA! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedevan Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I know I'd love to own every zed released in 2 seater form (z31 as a 200zr), and there will be differences between them and what market they were trying to reach, hence this discussion. It's a fact that the target market changed, and sucks that it changed so much they decided to not import 2 seaters for so long. I think a debate about what this 'club' isn't what is really being discussed, and anyone who wants to hang around can hang around in my experiance (datsun roadsters, 280zx's, gtr's and silvias), however it is an S30 club at heart, that was the point of it to seperate it from the clubs that already existed? and the technical knownledge found on this site should stick to being primarily about s30's, not "where can i find red velour?" type stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bullzed Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 and the technical knownledge found on this site should stick to being primarily about s30's, not "where can i find red velour?" type stuff That puts the ZX owners in a bad light, we don't ask asinine questions like that. If the primary subject for the forum is the S30 then perhaps remove the 280ZX from the forum name. If you google '280ZX club' the first thing to come up is this forum, that's how I found it. Whilst people say we shouldn't get butthurt from all the shit talk towards the ZX's, it can still be confronting. To quote Tim Minchin; 'Sticks and stone may break your bones, but words can break hearts'. I think we should welcome any who come on with Nissans or Datsuns, or at very least any Z's AND ZX's. You guys have lost a great member in Galderdi, I can understand where he's coming from, you never hear ZX members giving S30 members any crap about their cars, so why do we get it? We're in the forum name too... I think people should be more open minded and allow others with an interest in Z's to be amongst us, it was inevitable for this thread to become quite sour, I know it wasn't intended but it makes me sad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedevan Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 That puts the ZX owners in a bad light, we don't ask asinine questions like that that was about the only question zx i could think of that's fortunately completely irrelevent for z owners I like your zx and have no issue with you being a member, and as 280's share the same engine it makes sense for you guys to be included off topic - I saw a 944 being retrimed at a place with brand new velour in the factory style and it actually looked really nice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvemfast Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I've never taken this thread as a 280ZX bashing. It doesn't matter what someone else thinks of my car. I love it! It drives Ace! And it would hose most cars on the road! I wouldn't be calling for 280ZX's to be excluded from this Z site. They share a lot of history and parts. But as previously stated. As these cars get rarer, the club will shrink. I would look at the opposite with the issue Gav toyed with. Extending it towards all Z models. S30, S130, Z31, Z32, Z33 and Z34. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzzzed Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I have driven an rx8 and in my opinion it was alot more underpowerd than I expected Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
260DET Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 Ah the Z31, drove a near new NA one to Bathurst and back from Brisbane, what a disappointment. Just plain soft and gutless. Problem in AU apprently is that most new 'sports' car buyers want soft with all the fruit, handling etc is not a priority. Having said that, a modded two seater perhaps with a LSx donk and upgraded suspension and brakes would be fine by me. Like the 280ZX all they need are big wheels and a frontal facelift, just like any old bitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nizm0zed Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I have driven an rx8 and in my opinion it was alot more underpowerd than I expected a stock one? They are a little plump around the edges and the motor makes all its power up top, so you have to rev it. But trust me, once you do a few mods and some weight reduction, they are incredibly fun to drive OT, I can see there may be some light hearted ribbing at the 280ZX owners expense, but i dont see why they should be excluded from anything. Afterall, given the age of the car and the general market that keeps playing with them, we are all the same like minded enthusiasts. Or is there a prevailing attitude from the narrow minded 1% that you should ONLY like S30's and nothing else, no other marque or model? Coz that'd be stupid, i like lots of different cars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
positivetennis Posted January 17, 2012 Share Posted January 17, 2012 I think as we head further into the future you have to become more inclusive of all models to stay relevant. Already now its very hard to find an s30 or even s130 in good condition to buy and enjoy. The other issue is affordability. Good z31's and z32's are more affordable than s30's making zed ownership more possible this way. If you restrict membership to one series, you may find the numbers drop off in the future, both due to the lack of cars available and the tastes of the future younger generations. I think it is good forward planning to consider broadening options. The same would apply to the 300zx Association. How relevant will this organisation become when 350z's become cheap cars and people start to collect them. Being pro-active is very important. I remember when the Sydney Zed club first started and had their first concourse at Darling Harbour about the same time the z32 was released. You had all models represented and Nissan also had their new z32 on display. It was an event that had broad mass appeal from all ages and demographics both from members and an interested public. I am not sure how they are going these days but their website hasn't been updated much lately and the forum is pretty quiet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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