Inserts for sectioned struts

[zr240]

Hi All

 

Just after some info on what shorter strut options (front and rear) there are for the 240z.

 

I want to section about 25-50mm or so as I want to lower my car a bit more and are running out of travel.

 

I have heard MR2 struts are shorter but only can find info on international sites and thought would be good to get local info etc.

 

Let me know if im making sence here

 

Ash

[C.A.R.]

Your making sense

AE92 struts I believe are suitable - I'd need to confirm though.

 

OR you could always turret your strut towers by 25mm mate

That's what I'll be doing...

 

 

[Mr240z]

Ash talk to a bloke called Ken at Jim Hunter's suspension at Blacktown nsw

 

He just sorted me out with special Koni red's for a lowed 240z

 

He lives and breaths shocks. Tell him Paul from autopro homebush sent you.

 

http://www.yellowpages.com.au/bi/jim-hunters-suspension-blacktown-nsw-3739408.html

 

p.s ask him about the MR2 struts that will fit , he'd know.

[zed240au]

i sectioned my struts 50 mm and used my front inserts in rear struts and got some vw rabbit front strut inserts for front they are 75 mm shorter so i made up 25 mm spacer from 40 mm exhaust pipe too adjust to suit the 50 mm sectioning

 

got brand new vw rabbit bilstein inserts for front from usa for less than a third of what local bilstein guy wanted

 

i also fitted adjustable camber plates from arizona z car all round which with twin 2.5" exhaust made car bit lower than i wanted with 15" wheels so ended up fitting 17 " wheels very happy now

[C.A.R.]

Ash, apprently the AE92 ones fit - they are about 50mm shorter.

 

Z31 inserts fit & are a bit longer than the AE92 ones, but still shorter than OEM items.

[zr240]

Thanks for all the great replies

 

at the moment Im doing it a bit on the cheap so the bil's and konis are going to be a bit deal but thanks for the info anyways

 

Thanks

[nat0_240_chevZ]

z31 strut inserts only fit the 260z strut, yes mr2 and other toyota (similar / same part #) fit.

 

basically there are 4 types (main) that are similar in design available,

i had posted ages ago about a cross refference chart i had posted from monroe. look into their product catalgues etc as the have diagrams and dimensions open, closed and shft and body lengths.

 

from my research ages ago also i found that you can used shorter strut cartridges without sectioning the struts, as you use a cylinder type spacer ontop of the insert between the gland nut and strut body. but big enought to stay around the edge of the insert shaft as it could scratch it if loose etc.

 

this is the easiest mod i feel and is suited to lowering the car if you use heavier spring rates as you dont need all that extra travel sectioning gives you back, i mean how often do you want to scrape the sump or croossmember on the ground.

You still have about 1-1 & 3/4 inches of travel after lowering on the struts, so if racing or running stiffer springs i wouldnt even bother with the sectioning.

If youre using for rally then this is a different story.

 

I definatley still have the pdf's somewhere either here at work or at home.

 

ill have a look anyways.

 

nat0

[kevinlvy]

z31 strut inserts only fit the 260z strut, yes mr2 and other toyota (similar / same part #) fit.

 

basically there are 4 types (main) that are similar in design available,

i had posted ages ago about a cross refference chart i had posted from monroe. look into their product catalgues etc as the have diagrams and dimensions open, closed and shft and body lengths.

 

from my research ages ago also i found that you can used shorter strut cartridges without sectioning the struts, as you use a cylinder type spacer ontop of the insert between the gland nut and strut body. but big enought to stay around the edge of the insert shaft as it could scratch it if loose etc.

 

this is the easiest mod i feel and is suited to lowering the car if you use heavier spring rates as you dont need all that extra travel sectioning gives you back, i mean how often do you want to scrape the sump or croossmember on the ground.

You still have about 1-1 & 3/4 inches of travel after lowering on the struts, so if racing or running stiffer springs i wouldnt even bother with the sectioning.

If youre using for rally then this is a different story.

 

I definatley still have the pdf's somewhere either here at work or at home.

 

ill have a look anyways.

 

nat0

 

hmmm interesting i was also thinking of buying kits or that stuff so with the easy mod by nat0 may i have a chance of saving money and slamming my car. thanks for the info do hope you find the pdfs

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by nat0_240_chevZ

.....basically there are 4 types (main) that are similar in design available,

i had posted ages ago about a cross refference chart i had posted from monroe. look into their product catalgues etc as the have diagrams and dimensions open, closed and shft and body lengths.....

 

Mate, I would be very happy to know the details of that research...

 

I get a lot of enquiry for Z-car strut inserts as I do a good discount price for forum members (more than 25%) on Konis. This question comes up all the time.

 

.....from my research ages ago also i found that you can used shorter strut cartridges without sectioning the struts, as you use a cylinder type spacer on top of the insert between the gland nut and strut body. but big enough to stay around the edge of the insert shaft as it could scratch it if loose etc.

 

this is the easiest mod i feel and is suited to lowering the car if you use heavier spring rates as you don't need all that extra travel sectioning gives you back, i mean how often do you want to scrape the sump or crossmember on the ground.

You still have about 1-1 & 3/4 inches of travel after lowering on the struts, so if racing or running stiffer springs i wouldn't even bother with the sectioning.

If you're using for rally then this is a different story.....

 

Your basic proposition makes sense here... and then there's the ongoing value argument in its favour too...

 

I also don't like the idea of modifying the strut towers to suit, and that goes in concert with K-Mac's basic design philosophy too, where they have designed everything they make to bolt in to existing bodywork or suspension members.  Kevin does a very good job with that.

[C.A.R.]

Glad to have you aboard Ray

 

Can you please let us know your contact details, so as our members can get in contact with you for Koni pricing?

 

[Whittie]

I would love to know some more about this if anyone has some solid info.

 

I am having issues with my car bottoming out on the strut inserts, but don't want to have to chop/weld anything and don't have any budget for coil-overs. I have long suspected you could just get strut inserts with longer travel, but this is promising. Has anyone here successfully installed strut inserts with more travel for longer suspension travel in a 260z without having to cut the struts up?

 

**EDIT** editted for correct wording

[C.A.R.]

Yes - use standard length inserts.

[Whittie]

Lurch,

 

So, I get confused with the terminology a bit. What I meant was: Is it possible to get strut inserts that have a longer travel and will install in the standard struts without cutting and welding the struts themselves to make them shorter? I have Koni Red's at the moment, internally adjustable, and I have busted the valves due to bottoming out. I don't need much extra travel, but everything helps. I have also just purchased some polyurethane bump stops which will help as well, I'm looking to offset the suspension travel they consume, in an effort to maintain maximum linearity in the suspension travel.

 

Cheers.

[NZeder]

Not sure I fully understand your issue Whittie - so you have koni red for the stock length/replacing the stock insert. You are bottoming out and damaging the adjustment valve on the bottom. Sounds like the bump stops are warn out - hence your new purchase of bump stops I guess. So that should protect the valves. But the question is why are you bottoming out - it takes a bit of travel to bottom out the stock suspension. Given you track the car I am thinking you are running way too soft of spring rate for this type of work.

 

So what springs are you running?

 

This is a little of topic so to swing this back around - my 260z 2 seater 76/77, just like yours, but it had section struts however I was not using coil overs. The setup Lovell 225lb springs front and rear, larger front sway bar and none on the rear and koni yellows (adjustment on the tops, I can't recall the insert but I have the partnumbers somewhere will check and post here for reference). The rear springs were just captive at their free length = did not need a spring compressor to install just need to two people, 1 to press the top down while the other got the nut started.

 

So this old setup I had still had the stock spring perches in the stock location - but the strut was sections above this location for the short insert bodies.

[NZeder]

Ok found the partnumber that were used in my old setup.

 

The Fronts were 8641-1146 = Toyota Corolla GT 88-93 (AE92 as stated above my Lurch)

 

And the rears were 8641-1041 = Discontinued were from a 82-86 Toyota Supra I think

 

I have since sold these inserts (I had them rebuilt) to a local 240z owner for his targa/track/road 240z - but I have kept the sections struts - not for sale but I can measure the length if required.

 

[Whittie]

Cheers Mike.

 

The issue is that I have lowered the car too far with shorter springs and now there is not enough strut insert travel. It seems to bottom out well and truely before the end of where I would have thought the stroke would be. There is a good 3cm of rod sticking out the insert when it is fully compressed, I would like to recover some of this.

 

I like your idea however, of sectioning the strut WITHOUT changing the spring perch height. If you could please measure this then that is the route I will take. I am very happy with the ride height and spring rates, I just need some extra travel, which it sounds like the AE92 strut inserts will give me.

[nat0_240_chevZ]

Lurch,

 

So, I get confused with the terminology a bit. What I meant was: Is it possible to get strut inserts that have a longer travel and will install in the standard struts without cutting and welding the struts themselves to make them shorter? I have Koni Red's at the moment, internally adjustable, and I have busted the valves due to bottoming out. I don't need much extra travel, but everything helps. I have also just purchased some polyurethane bump stops which will help as well, I'm looking to offset the suspension travel they consume, in an effort to maintain maximum linearity in the suspension travel.

 

Cheers.

yes ther are inserts with more travel that almost go straight in.......

HOWEVER its not the travel of the insert, its the top of the strut tube smacking your bumpstop out the top of your tower, and this is appearant even on stock ride height with stock suspension, ie chuck a u-turn through a spoon drain to proove.

DONT SUGGEST you try but if you did accidently you will know what im talking about.

nat0

[NZeder]

Cheers Mike.

 

The issue is that I have lowered the car too far with shorter springs and now there is not enough strut insert travel. It seems to bottom out well and truely before the end of where I would have thought the stroke would be. There is a good 3cm of rod sticking out the insert when it is fully compressed, I would like to recover some of this.

 

I like your idea however, of sectioning the strut WITHOUT changing the spring perch height. If you could please measure this then that is the route I will take. I am very happy with the ride height and spring rates, I just need some extra travel, which it sounds like the AE92 strut inserts will give me.

That explains it Tom I kept the struts for what I am guessing is the same reason you don't want to go coilovers - to have that stock look and no issue with classic racing rules if they are looking for stock type setups

 

I have going to the new AZC coilover setup - ie whole shock is threaded blah blah - but kept the old setup without the inserts as you never know one day I might just go back to this type of setup - keeping my options open

 

I will pop out to the garage after work tonight and get the camera and tape out. Now for others this set is for the later 260z struts in the later shell ie has the taller rear strut towers. Also this setup was using the shorter isolators on the tops. If I recall correctly one of the inserts was installed with a spacer/packer on the bottom, however I can't recall if this was the fronts or the rears now

[NZeder]

Ok pics and measurement time

 

Now I don't have a stock 260z front strut to compare with so only the rear could be compared with a stock 260z rear leg.

 

All measurements from the bottom of the strut tube to the top without the gland nut installed. So for the front that was the bottom of the strut were the steering arm mounts to the top. And the rears was from the bottom of the casting holding the tube to the top.

 

My sectioned fronts are 360mm tall.

My sectioned rears are 410mm tall vs stock at 470mm

 

Now for some pics see the attachments

[NZeder]

More pics of the rears

[Whittie]

Thanks Mike!!!!! 

 

I'll be taking these pics to the suspension shop and working out part numbers for appropriate shocks and then cut once when I know the proper amount to remove.

[NZeder]

Tom this might help before the visit the suspension shop

 

http://www.koniracing.com/8611.cfm

 

Also FYI M51 x 1.5p 260z Gland Nut and those with 240z struts they are M48 x 1.5p

19425_7481490bf2349673d041a20286e9eb39c5c916b0.pdf

[nat0_240_chevZ]

buy your inserts, shorter ones.

install them and mark your shock shaft at the bottom where the gland nut is. pull shock up to top, bottoming out or topping out on the gland nut.

mark again, measure the difference between marks.

remove this much from your strut tube, easy.

nat0

[Scottz]

I just bought these inserts for a 260Z 2+2. Haven't fitted them yet and wont get a chance until Feb'11.

Tokico illumina BZ3125

Tokico illumina BZ3015

The warranty from Tokico is void if:

1.  The vehicle is lowered too far (between 25 to 45mm is okay for 'most' cars), or

2.  The shock or strut is modified (eg; aftermarket adjustable spring seats and collars).

 

Tokico Illumina's can handle spring rates up to about 325 lb's.

You can use the short stroke inserts in the OEM tubes, with spacer under them to take up the gap, or you can shorten the strut tubes.

I was advised to shorten the strut tube only 25mm and use a spacer to work out the rest. I guess that's good conservative advice. For users with adjustable coilovers, once you know exactly how far you want your ride dropped, then you could make the permanent mod. For users with fixed spring perch and shorter coils, you can cut and shut just as nat0 described.

It's users choice, but be careful ! Make a small change first, test it, and then decide. Or wait for someone else to figure it all out and follow along. 

 

Scottz.

[Whittie]

I was advised to shorten the strut tube only 25mm and use a spacer to work out the rest.

 

Scottz.

 

 

After doing some more thinking about this problem, this is exactly what I am going to do.

 

I only need a small amount of more travel, nothing drastic, and don't want to start running in to issues with the chassis rails bottoming out before the shocks hit the bump-stops!

 

I don't know what my spring rates are, or what shocks I have in the car currently, so I'm going to have to resort to taking the car to a suspension place once it's running again, getting all the height measurements made, spring rate's tested and selecting the adjustable shocks to match the springs I have. At the moment I believe I have Koni (red?) internally adjustable shocks. The proportining valve is totally busted, but I have the shocks wound to full resistence and they still are not hard enough, so I don't want to buy new shocks and run in to issue's of being on full adjustment, one way or the other, and still not have the ideal setting for the springs in the car.