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Hello From California, Early S30 Restore


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8 hours ago, dom said:

Curious if there are any photos I can reference for how to refinish the underside of the rear spoiler. I have an early ribbed spoiler (PZR I believe it is referred to as) that I purchased from Japan. To my understanding (read: hope) it is a factory piece.

From what I've seen on other cars, it looks like the underside is meant to be left open, instead of having a flat plane/base?

It is nicknamed the 'PZR' rear spoiler because that design was first seen on the PS30-SB model Fairlady Z432-R, for which the factory shorthand code was 'PZR'.

Originals were made from woven fibreglass cloth roving rather than chopped strand (most of the later copies were chopped strand) and there were 6 mounting points: Two inboard (accessed through the drain tube holes in the tailgate) and four outboard (holes drilled through the skin of the tailgate at either end, as in your photo). 

Underside of the spoiler was 'open', and the mounting brackets were simple steel tabs with captive studs, moulded/glued into the spoiler body. The very ends of the spoiler originally had rubber seals glued on, and theoretically they sealed against the body where the ends of the spoiler overlapped the tailgate. In practice they often got knocked off before long...

Here's an original:

 

PZR rear spoiler-TA-1.JPG

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Heading into first stage of primer: 

It's been a long while since I've posted anything in this thread, but happily I have progress to share. The car is 99% out of metalwork, just about every panel save the roof has had some (or a lot) of

After selling my 73 240z (owned for 10 years, still stings thinking about it) last year, I happened upon a dream car.   It has a long road to recovery, but I'm the proud owner of vin 00931, a 69 Fai

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On 2/10/2021 at 3:05 AM, HS30-H said:

Underside of the spoiler was 'open', and the mounting brackets were simple steel tabs with captive studs, moulded/glued into the spoiler body. The very ends of the spoiler originally had rubber seals glued on, and theoretically they sealed against the body where the ends of the spoiler overlapped the tailgate. In practice they often got knocked off before long...

Here's an original:

Thank you so, so much Alan. This is exactly what I was looking for. Never knew about the rubber seals, another neat detail.

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Yeah I had no idea about the rubber seals either.

Alan do you know anyone who is making good replicas of the original in terms of mounting and details like the seals?

Lots of people churn them out without those details.

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5 hours ago, gav240z said:

Alan do you know anyone who is making good replicas of the original in terms of mounting and details like the seals?

No. (ha ha!).

Flippant answer, but I haven't seen anything I would consider a 100% perfect replica of either the early 'ribbed' 432-R/'PZR' spoiler or the smoother ABS type that superseded it (also seen as OEM fitment on UK and 'Euro' market cars).

The 432-R/'PZR' type (see my photo above) had shockingly poor mountings. The mouldings themselves were lovely, pretty much hand made, but they were let down by having mounts which were just bits of bent steel with studs sticking out of them. Rubbish! The later type was a one-piece ABS moulding with the mounting studs incorporated into the moulding, which are MILES better. They also fit the tailgate better, having the correct curvature.

Most of the USA-made replicas I've seen (although I'm sure I won't have seen all of them...) are fairly primitive. They can be made to work just fine, but they are noticeably different in comparison to the OEM types. Most recognisably they never seem to have the raised pedestal area on the RH side for the emblems to sit on.

I've not looked for a rubber end seal profile that matches the OEM pieces. I've got some stashed away somewhere, so I'll have to dig them out. 

 

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Well it's reasonable to suppose that Nissan-Datsun origin bobtails were available via dealerships around the world which then enabled them to be replicated (more or less) by local fibreglass artisans at less cost.

Alan, front spoilers too?

My NZ-new RS30 has quite a tidy bobtail complete with the raised section Alan mentioned. This from a country that makes pretty much anything using fibreglass... jet boats, pleasure craft, beach buggies, kit cars..... ;D 

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Frustrated at myself for not checking this sooner, but I’m not 100% the fenders are original to the car and I never checked the mounting location for the fender mirrors.

I know that the mirrors were positioned asymmetrically from the factory, and that there isn’t necessarily a “correct” but for a RHD car does the driver’s side sit further to the nose of the car than the passenger side.

On my car the right side (driver’s) mirror is about an inch and half closer to the front of the car compared to the left side.

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This is a question for Gav I think. This JDM mirror positioning topic came up on the forum way back in 2009/2010.

According to my filed info and dimensions from back then - which I hope are correct - yes, on a JDM (RHD) car the driver side mirror is closer to the front of the car by 3.5cm, and also 2cm in closer to the bonnet/hood.

Does that match with what you've got?

Gav and others might like to chip in here as I recall there was quite a robust discussion about the matter back in the day, with people unsure which dimensions were 'correct'.

Edited by gilltech
typo, improved grammar
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22 hours ago, gilltech said:

the driver side mirror is closer to the front of the car by 3.5cm, and also 2cm in closer to the bonnet/hood.

Does that match with what you've got?

That looks pretty close, I'll get a measurement from the inner fender to the mounting spots, but I'm not as worried based on your information. Thanks!

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Getting so close, looking for opinions on some details, specifically the rounding of the corner edges on the rear of the car. They feel a little sharp right now, though I know it’s difficult to see in the photos.

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On 2/22/2021 at 11:24 AM, gilltech said:

Gav and others might like to chip in here as I recall there was quite a robust discussion about the matter back in the day, with people unsure which dimensions were 'correct'.

It's a massive can of worms. There was a diagram floating around on many S30Z based forums that shows mirror positioning etc.. and many poor souls have perhaps followed it incorrectly and drilled in the wrong spot as a result.

My car HS30 00051 still has the original factory guards and fender mirror holes in it. Which I've been meaning to measure up for some time now, but don't have direct access to the car atm.

But I believe and @HS30-H will no doubt correct me if I'm wrong, that they were offset from factory in terms of position from driver/passenger and ultimately where you put them is really up to you and where you think they look best. More so than strictly following a diagram to the exact mm.

Also measuring from a rounded edge of a guard (outer guard) to an exact location is difficult at best.

I'd offer to measure up my guards on HS30-00051 but the car is not stored with me at the moment. So will be some time before I could do so.

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Getting so close, looking for opinions on some details, specifically the rounding of the corner edges on the rear of the car. They feel a little sharp right now, though I know it’s difficult to see in the photos.

Well, FWIW they look perfectly fine to me, looking at my RS30 / 260Z, those swage lines are indeed a fairly tight radius.

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As I recall on this forum back in 2009/2010 there were quite a number of Zed owners wanting to go down the path for what I would call the JDM 'Fairlady Z' look with G noses, the add-on guard flares (necessitating cutting back the rear wheel arches), 'Fairlady' badging, and the hockey stick mirrors, etc. Much chat about positioning of the mirrors, and much disbelief that the JDM mirrors weren't mounted symmetrically!

I saved the JDM mirror positioning diagram that was posted on this forum back then, just out of interest. But as to where it originated, and it's accuracy or otherwise, I have no idea. But your guards already have the holes in place, so surely they are right. I suggest you mock up the JDM mirrors if you have them to check their fit, and also if you don't like the positioning then now is the time to change one or both of them before you paint!

I presume the off-set mirrors was a JDM thing?  Because my NZ-new RS30/260Z originally had hockey stick mirrors (big chrome things), but positioned symmetrically. AFAIK the export 240Zs and 260Zs sold new in NZ had the hockey stick mirrors, unlike Australia-new Zeds which generally got a single door mirror did they not?

At the end of the day it's your car that you are doing such a commendably thorough job on and you have to like the final outcome.

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I appreciate that, my primary goal is to be respectful of the original details for the car but I am deviating in a few small places.

I was able to inspect an absolute time capsule of an S30 owned by a friend and compare some lines/angles. I’ll have the shop round the edges on the rear a little more.

I should have mounted mirrors on the car to check, though all the data points are lining up thus far and I’m feeling good about the fenders as they are.

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