Riceburner Posted March 6, 2017 Share Posted March 6, 2017 The headers look and sound great! What size is the pipework from the headers back? I'm interested to see how the SU's go come dyno time, do you have any previous figures to compare when the webers were on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted March 11, 2017 Author Share Posted March 11, 2017 Hi Gareth, exhaust is 2 1/2". I don't have any power figures from the webers, only data I had is from the wideband data logger and butt dyno Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted March 24, 2017 Author Share Posted March 24, 2017 I recorded a WOT run with the WBO2 and I'm pretty happy with the SM needles. I had the expectation that it would be rich as all buggery but it was little on the lean side which is not totally great for power but a fair compromise. Now all I need is to organise that dyno run! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted April 5, 2017 Author Share Posted April 5, 2017 170hp @ 5600. Not bad for a home built $5k stroker on stock carbs! Video to follow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted April 6, 2017 Author Share Posted April 6, 2017 Video of dyno run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted September 8, 2018 Author Share Posted September 8, 2018 Phew! What a hiatus! Since the last post only small changes have been made. The car survived the 4.5 hour drive from Toowoomba to Bundy in one continuous run back in April 2017. It used about 10l/100k which I thought was odd but put further investigation on the low priority pile. Upon checking with the LM2 the cruise to WOT section of the needle was indeed running very lean. I promptly ordered RU and RV needles to see if that would fix the problem. The RV needles got near perfect AFR at top end but cruise sat at about 10:1. Humph! I settled on a half baked band aid measure of lifting the floats up a few mm and sticking the SM needles back in. This made things a little richer (13.5:1 approx at WOT) but is not the long term solution I desire. If you plan to maintain the Hitachi SUs on your car yourself I can not recommend enough getting a ‘Float-sync’ tool. I’m not sure if they are still manufactured but they are bloody helpful when setting the floats! I got mine from here: https://zcardepot.com/carburetor-float-sync-tool-su-240z.html That was around October 2017. Fast forward to now, I am able to ‘donate’ more of my time the ol’ girl. I have set a goal to aim for 200RWHP on the SUs without opening the engine. I have a spiel on the plan on my YouTube channel which can be seen here. The three areas to focus efforts are: - Removing the recycled section between the Zstory headers and muffler and putting something better flowing in - New or custom needles for the carbs to get the AFRs where they should be - Muck with the advance profile in the dizzy. Currently the ‘all in’ advance is far to low. I’m thinking MSD 6AL-2 with locked dizzy or repurpose the MS1 I have on the shelves with a CAS. After all this is done it’ll be off to the dyno. If I don’t get 200 aitch pees I can always bust open the motor and port the head to the buggery, swap in a new cam or just admit defeat and put triples or EFI on it! RAP260 and gav240z 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted September 21, 2018 Author Share Posted September 21, 2018 (edited) The first of many pieces of the puzzle for the road to 200whp on round top Hitachis has been completed. The old POS bit of exhaust I recycled from the system that came with the car 10 years ago is out and replaced with a Zstory centre pipe. The car now has a full Zstory offering: Race sport header centre pipe with silencer JDM style muffler I could not be more impressed with the sound! The new silencer is leagues ahead of what was in there. I think the change from aluminised steel to full stainless steel has contributed. The note sounds ‘clean’ and not as ‘cheap’ as it used to sound. The system was also extremely easy to fit and all I had to do was bend up a ‘z’ bracket out of thin flat plate to help align one exhaust mounting point with the point on the body. I wanted teh rubber isolator mounts to be vertical. Anyway, I put the install and a sound check in a video if anyone is interested. Edited September 21, 2018 by Neuby Bad link RAP260 and gav240z 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted October 6, 2018 Author Share Posted October 6, 2018 I’ve decided to use the part built MS1 v3.0 megasquirt with MSExtra code as a programmable ignition. I will retain the MSD 6AL and pertronix igniter 1. I did look at 123ignition, MSD 6AL programmable, etc. and these were all good products but I went with the megasquirt as I already had it. There are also other peripherals the MS1 can control and I hope to knock together a means on the proto area of the V3.0 board to output a signal for the temp gauge to use. The original temp sender is cactus. Another task is locking the distributor. I think I may have found a copyright free STL file for a lock out block on the net. If it is what I think it is I’ll get something printed up in ABS...problem is I don’t think there are any local printers so this may take some time.... There is a video on my YouTube channel but its me waffling on so I haven’t embedded it in the post. Ponyo240z and RAP260 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted November 4, 2018 Author Share Posted November 4, 2018 I turned my attention to optimising the needles in the Hitachi SUs. I took the function stations from the SM, RV and RU needles I’ve trialed previously and went searching for a best match. I went to use the Mintylamb.co.uk resource but found that had closed down some time ago. Ended up using Teglerizer’s resource http://www.teglerizer.com/suneedledb/ to find SB needles were the closest. Ended up sticking the needles in without lowering the fuel floats down from the band aid fix to riches top end with the SM needles. The SB needles worked a treat and the AFRs are offset by the amount that raising the float changed. Overall very happy. Next port of call is to lower the floats to factory and I reckon I will have 99% convergence to the best mixture I can achieve without making custom needles. Ponyo240z, gav240z, Hokin and 1 other 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators gav240z Posted November 5, 2018 Administrators Share Posted November 5, 2018 I love these videos! Super helpful for anyone wanting to tune their carbs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted November 5, 2018 Author Share Posted November 5, 2018 10 hours ago, gav240z said: I love these videos! Super helpful for anyone wanting to tune their carbs. Cheers Gav! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted November 9, 2018 Author Share Posted November 9, 2018 (edited) Following on from the SB needle install I decided to adjust the float level to factory. Previously I had the float level a little higher as a band aid fix to richen the top end mixture of the SM needles. The rear float bowl gave me grief. I think I had the lid off 20 times before the geometry of the float was massaged so it wouldn’t stick in the bowl not closing the jet properly. I got there in the end. When you bending little metal tabs minute amounts you need a good swag of patience. Using the float sync tool and a trusty bit of clear pine dressed down to 9/16” thick the floats are set to the same level. The Nissan workshop manual suggests making one float higher than the other, presumably for G forces under acceleration, but I’ve never done this. Working on the 240Z is not the highest priority in my life (although I wish it could be!) so road testing and datalogging with the Innovate LM2 wideband will have to wait. Video below. Edited November 9, 2018 by gav240z Fixed embed. RAP260 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators gav240z Posted November 9, 2018 Administrators Share Posted November 9, 2018 Hi mate, To embed Youtube clips just copy the raw URL into the text area and the software will automatically detect it's a Youtube URL and attempt to embed it for you. If you add it as a link it will remain as text instead. I see a lot of folks making this mistake. Although I think the problem might have been the video was still processing and the software couldn't find the video until it was finished. Fixed it now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted November 10, 2018 Author Share Posted November 10, 2018 6 hours ago, gav240z said: Hi mate, To embed Youtube clips just copy the raw URL into the text area and the software will automatically detect it's a Youtube URL and attempt to embed it for you. If you add it as a link it will remain as text instead. I see a lot of folks making this mistake. Although I think the problem might have been the video was still processing and the software couldn't find the video until it was finished. Fixed it now. Many thanks Gav! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted November 17, 2018 Author Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) Slowing chipping away little by little. I mucked with the Megasquirt 1 this week. Got the V3.0 board sorted from where I left it two years ago from a full EFI build. Flashed MS/Extra and plugged it in to the PC with the stim board (after I installed the USB to RS232 driver for the cable ) and low and behold it worked first time! I'm pretty stoked that it worked. I don't have any special hardware built other than the standard configuration. It is literally taking the signal from the Pertronix unit and manifold pressure from the vacuum advance pickup and determining ignition advance from the ignition table. I will have to zero fill all the other tables. next step is get the wiring loom in order although I won't need a lot of wires for what I'm doing.... Edited November 18, 2018 by Neuby RAP260 and jeff43 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted November 25, 2018 Author Share Posted November 25, 2018 I found some interesting parameters in the Tunerstudio software about launch control and flat shifting which got me thinking and consequently the megasquirt case hasn’t stayed assembled for long! I’ve build a protective circuit on the prototyping area to ground a 5v signal from JS11 leg of the CPU. This will be used to trigger launch control and flat shifting functions. I don’t know how this will function with the SU carbs as the MS1 is only controlling ignition. I suspect backfiring will ensue! I’ll have to build a clutch switch if launch control passes testing. I want the car to be about function not form. If the launch control doesn’t prove useful, I’ll bin it. Oh and the wiring loom of less than ten wires is also complete…… Enzo, KatoKid, 260DET and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted December 6, 2018 Author Share Posted December 6, 2018 Mech advance in the distributor is locked! It’s slow progress but thats better than no progress. Next is wiring the megasquirt! I can’t wait to test the launch control feature and see if I can’t blow up the exhaust.... Share the vid if you know someone who might benefit from it. gav240z 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted December 20, 2018 Author Share Posted December 20, 2018 Finally got around to mucking with the megasquirt wiring harness. There isn’t a lot to wire up with the MS1 in ignition only configuration. It took nearly a week doing little bits here and there coming up to Christmas. It didn’t go to plan but the advantage of this being a project car is I can just shut up the garage until next year! Merry Christmas all and have a happy new year! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted January 6, 2019 Author Share Posted January 6, 2019 I snagged some time over the Christmas break to fault find the Megasquirt MS1 install. I 100% expected the problem to be something simple. Sometimes I hate it when I’m right… I hypothesised two possible problems. One being the ECU itself and the other the wiring loom. The ECU powered up and connected to the Tunerstudio when plugged into the Megastim board. Happy days that the ECU was not toast! This left the wiring harness. Voltage was getting to pin on the harness. That left that the harness was incorrectly made, that the voltage was going to the wrong pin. A quick review of my notes, physical verification and sure enough power was going to the wrong pin. A quick swap of the pin and the ECU powered up when connected to the wiring harness. I’m glad it was something minor and simple. Next stop, ECU tuning! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted January 17, 2019 Author Share Posted January 17, 2019 I was able to play home tuner using Tunerstudio to set put the parameters and rough in an ignition table for the MS1. There wasn’t a lot to set up with an ignition only configuration, the ECU is pretty under utilised as far as it’s overall capacity. Even though the hardware does not exist for the injector circuits, I zeroed the injector table data. To bench test the MS1, I used the Megastim board and a syringe with vacuum tube for the MAP. A 60ml syringe wasn’t big enough to generate enough vacuum to get to the closed throttle parts of the map but it was helpful still. I had help from Godzilla Raceworks who saw one of my Instagram posts and offered up an example tuning file from an MS2 used on a similar engine. I’m very appreciative for their assistance. https://www.godzillaraceworks.com/ There are a few items I need to address before attempting to start the car with the MS1 and new SU needles. The vacuum line for the MAP needs a home on the intake manifold and the signal wires from the Pertronix unit need a little tweaking to introduce voltage because the Pertronix unit doesn’t generate its only power, its only a switch essentially. gav240z 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators gav240z Posted January 29, 2019 Administrators Share Posted January 29, 2019 By the way, love what you're doing but if someone else wanted to just have a programmable ignition in their 240z. This might be a better option? http://123ignition.nl/ https://www.classiczcars.com/forums/topic/61473-datsun-240260280z-123-ignition-programmable-bluetooth-distributor/ Local distributor in Hawthorn VIC. https://www.123ignition.com.au Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndBir Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 30 minutes ago, gav240z said: programmable ignition in their 240z. This might be a better option? http://123ignition.nl/ With a nice added benefit of the 123Tune+ distributor being able to be disabled as an Antitheft system by a PIN code? gav240z 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators gav240z Posted January 29, 2019 Administrators Share Posted January 29, 2019 Looks like it. http://123ignition.nl/product.phtml?id=221 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted January 31, 2019 Author Share Posted January 31, 2019 On 1/29/2019 at 1:32 PM, gav240z said: By the way, love what you're doing but if someone else wanted to just have a programmable ignition in their 240z. This might be a better option? http://123ignition.nl/ https://www.classiczcars.com/forums/topic/61473-datsun-240260280z-123-ignition-programmable-bluetooth-distributor/ Local distributor in Hawthorn VIC. https://www.123ignition.com.au Absolutely the 123Ignition is a much less involved ignition that what I’m doing. I did look at this and the only reason I went with the Megasquirt was that I had the Megasquirt kit already (i’m I’m ‘frugal’). They look like a good bit of kit. I did correspond with 123 and I believe they confirmed it would operate with CDI ignitions like the MSD 6AL. The moment of truth arrived for the first startup with the Megasquirt configured for ignition only and the SB needles in the SU carbs. The distributor needed to be aligned with the trigger angle parameter in the ECU which was easy to to. I did hit a road bump with a leak from a MAP vac hose that was larger than the onboard MAP sensor barb. That was fixed with a smaller vac hose 3mm in diameter from Super Cheap Auto. I had to buy the stand out blue coloured silicon stuff made by SAAS because the roll of non descipt black was empty. With the problem fixed the car runs but I want to revisit the ignition table before driving and adjust the SU mixture nuts after. The idle vacuum is a little different to what I thought it would be and revving the engine without load cause some hesitation around the 3k RPM mark which makes me think I have the advance ramping up too fast in the table. gav240z and jeff43 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Neubauer Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 So the little niggling issues continue. While travelling to a local informal coffee and cars show I discovered a problem with the ignition timing. It felt like an ignition ‘wall’ at around 3,400 RPM. My first thoughts were it was something other than the ignition advance. I’ve had 36 degrees in this motor when it ran the tripled 45DCOE152s years ago. I just assumed the engine could take the same again. I was going to check the signal form from the Pertronix in the event that signal noise was causing interference. I wasn’t real sure how to condition an I/O type signal. In the end it was the ignition advance. When the table ramped up to 31 degrees at 3,400 RPM, the engine couldn’t take it. Trialing lower advance in the same areas of the table allow the engine to rev properly. I’m glad it was an easy fix and I am surprised that with running the SUs with SB needles that the engine characteristics changed. A new chapter has been added to my ‘book of Datsun’. Anyway the ignition table has been revised to lower advance levels and hopefully this will be a suitable base for some road tuning. If anyone has come across changes in ignition behaviour with different setup ups, I’d love to hear it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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