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Classic car bubble

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easy to be smart in hindsight, but i believe that car was advertised by the "sex in the city" chick

should have known better

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2 hours ago, aircobra said:

in regards to the porshe $s, it seems to be that

1. 924/4 was always a poverty special and still doesn't stand out. 0-100 its slower then a stock Z. Why bother? I actually owned a 924 way back and its VW van engine, complete with vw badges always made me laugh

2. 928 belongs to the "big engine grand touerer" class, which is a dead segment - just ask SUPRA, jaguar xjs and Subaru SVX owners, although clearly a supercar back in the day. The other factor is that it is a tempramental and complicated car, at least compared to the Z. The older they get, the more true it becomes. Have a look at one of the 928 engine rebuilds on youtube and you'll get weak knees and I would say a pro-rebuilt stock motor, not even at the dealer is a 20k proposition

3. So unsuprisingly that leaves the 911a as a "back to basics", compact  machine with a decent race history, which is worth the $$$s

That's just my take on it, ther'll be some porsche guy on this forum who may have a better analysis on that brand

and if that person has a 69-72 stock, it would be a fun race around the curves just to see how it would stack up against a z of the era. Until they pimped up the capacity in, I think, '73 it would be neck to neck

 

First of all the 924 and 944 are COMPLETELY 2 different cars, I don't know how you put them in the same basket. The 944 started with a 2.5 litre then later on with the S2 3.0 variant and a 944 turbo variant (951). The 944 S2 3.0 morphed into the 968 and the 968CS was voted as the world best sport car in the early 1990.

I've owned and track 944 S2, 944 turbo and 911, my least favourite would be the 911. If I have money and room to buy a Porsche now I would be looking for a 944 Turbo S (1989-1990) or a 986CS. But each to their own. On second thought I probably buy a Datsun roadster first.

If you want an example why there are no logics to classic car prices, someone just paid 0.5M on a '911' number plate. To me some people are so hung up by rarity, something rare does not necessary means it is great.

Edited by hmd

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7 minutes ago, hmd said:

If I have money and room to buy a Porsche now I would be looking for a 944 Turbo S (1989-1990) or a 986CS. But each to their own.

I have to admit after driving a 944 non turbo, I ached for a few days yerning for 1. Even if it was slow, it was just so fun!

I haven't driven a turbo, but I love the look of the 944's. Maybe it's because I'm an 80s kid? But it was the engine noise, the build quality (solid clunk of the doors). It's hard to explain but it's got a very mechanical solid feel. But it would lose almost any drag race. Handling is good with the gearbox up at the rear.

I'd never trade a 240z for a 944 though..I also think I'd buy a FC RX-7 Turbo over a 944 Turbo. The interior quality on the FC would let it down however the cost of Porsche parts is silly and running an FC RX-7 would be far cheaper, even with the cost of fuel.

I've been in a 400HP + 911 (930 turbo) and you can tell there is a lot of weight in the back. As much as I like the look of the 930 turbo, I just don't think they are worth the asking prices.

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30 minutes ago, gav240z said:

I also think I'd buy a FC RX-7 Turbo over a 944 Turbo.

I have so many car wants and not enough money and space.

Honda NSX, FD RX-7 and 944 Turbo S are my late 80 early 90 cars I would love to buy now.

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52 minutes ago, hmd said:

I have so many car wants and not enough money and space.

Honda NSX, FD RX-7 and 944 Turbo S are my late 80 early 90 cars I would love to buy now.

This would probably be quite a few people here, I, being one of them! haha

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I think the classic car market has been driven more by low interest rates and tax minimisation. That aside a correction in the markets or house prices would have a negative effect on the classic car market. As Gav said all asset markets are connected and basically unpredictable.

 

Jeff

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7 hours ago, hmd said:

I have so many car wants and not enough money and space.

Honda NSX, FD RX-7 and 944 Turbo S are my late 80 early 90 cars I would love to buy now.

Nah, current model 750hp Corvette would  do me, they actually do handle and brake now and by all reports are a blast to drive round corners.

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13 hours ago, hmd said:

First of all the 924 and 944 are COMPLETELY 2 different cars, I don't know how you put them in the same basket

But are they completely different really? I mean the genesis of the 944 is the 924. I believe it was an Audi project to begin with but was abandoned.

The 924 Carrera GT has the wider flares which is what the 944 was styled after.

There was also the 924 Carrera GTR which is an amazing car.

The problem when people talk of the 924s in general is they think of the basic model only. But the higher spec cars were really special in my humble opinion. If not unobtanium in the case of the GTR.

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/classic/you-need-porsche-924-gtr-heres-why#1

But yes I think most people go for the 944s given the fact they aren't really much more expensive.

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  • first in relation to the 944 - as a 112kw series one .( up to  184kw in later turbo cars). i'm staying away from the "specials" and "rare" versions

YES, it would have been DIFFERENT to drive, since it had bigger wheels and brakes, as well as  30% pwer bump up from the measley 82 kw van unit of the 924

NO, its not a different car in engineering terms to the 924 - it is still a 4 cyl, front engine, non turbo transaxle design 2 door platform, If you look at the blueprints, they're identical. In fact, in teh 80s you could buy a fiberglass kit with bigger guards, chuck on funchs wheel replicas and bob's your uncle

In a funny sidenote, a new 924 cost TWICE as much as 280ZX

  • but this thread is not about engineering but about market values

the tests for which is very simple - original factory price/price now. on that basis, the market has spoken and the 944/boxers/caymans/928 fail compared to the 911. period

  • as to the the abysmal nissan z story in 2018

want to know which mainstream jap brand has done a very neat 2 door car and a v8 as well?

https://www.lexus.com.au/models/lc/overview

Not saying its cheap, but gosh, the turrett line looks exactly of a 240 !!

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ok COMPLETELY is overstating it, but the 944 had a completely new Porsche design all alloy twin cam engine as compared to a VW van engine.

So it was a step more than an evolution.

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so 944 was around 40k in the 80s from memory, which must equate to 130k in 2018 money ( that's how much the cheapest boxter is)

yours for 15k today.

928 worth double the $s new, but now selling for the same - i think the maintenance $s would be keeping the  buyers away

... the market is a harsh judge

 

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Speaking of 944's. 

Its a auto, 2 owner with original 34000ks. Was sitting at the front of our neighbors house for 20 years and we bought it cheap. Has sun damage but no rust and still pulls great for what it is. 

20181018_132351.jpg

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Near me, someone was trying to grow a 928 in their front yard.

I was more keen on the Lotus, but 1 day I walked by and suddenly they had both moved.

IMG_20150509_151807.jpg

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It's possible they got rolled into the garage again (maybe cleared some space), but they are still trying to grow an Audi on the lawn :)

I really don't have the space though!

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back to the bubble, I don't know where prices are going but at least at the current level, I can justify to the missus why i spent so much money on my Z :)

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944's crack between the front of the sunroof to the top corner of the windscreen, T top Datsuns don't, Japanese engineering > German engineering.

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My sunroof rubbers have weathered and its leaking. Ordered the new rubber kit from Porsche to replace when it arrives

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Back in the 90's I had a Nissan EXA and it was like driving a slot car. Low and quick. Not a power monster but who wants to lose a license these days. On warm nights it was great to remove the top and cruise. Definitely one of my favourite cars that I have owned.

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A friend had 1 in the early 2000s. Looked exactly like the 1 in that article. It was on 5psi of boost. Sounded like a sewing machine and handled like a shopping trolley. I could never quite bring myself to like it. After that he got a CRX which I preferred.

I did see what they could do with a bit more boost and it was quite frightening the power it had in a car that had that sort of handling. :) 

scottset.jpg

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On 10/19/2018 at 1:06 PM, gav240z said:

Maybe, Maybe not - the last Falcon to have the 351C “T” on the spec plate & Top Loader combo. Some people say the modern XY-GT.

I was not all surprised by the result.

I imagine the XE Falcon guys think the current 240 prices are silly.

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