Sirpent Posted March 22, 2014 Author Share Posted March 22, 2014 Hi David Good to see you don't miss a beat on here............... ;-) We are just theorising and looking at alternatives Buddy, where's the fun if we don't push the envelope ? If someone hadn't tried a WRX or BMW rack in the past we would all be poorer for it ;-) Cheers John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Z Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Here's a pic of a SW20 Mr2 rack. Has the same offset bungs rather than side by side (parallel) and the reduced diameter section near the bush mount. I had a look at over 50 Toyota racks and its the closest to the one John pictured. Bear in mind there are many reproduction aftermarket units so looks can vary abit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirpent Posted March 22, 2014 Author Share Posted March 22, 2014 So Tai Do I take it you have the one in the photo in your hands? Cheers John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamo240 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 I have put thousands of miles on my Subaru power steering now and confirm it works great. It is absolutely silent....quieter than I had expected, and makes the car a much nicer thing to drive. My other half has a Porsche, and she loves it compared with her car! Looking at the photos, I think the fluid line in the middle of the rack would foul the harmonic balancer for straight 6 engines. It could be relocated, but another modification that the engineers don't like (welding, drilling, cutting of steering components). The Subaru rack is not inordinately difficult to fit, but does have the clearance issue with the RHS engine mount pedestal...if you are a half useful fabricator though, it's not hard to sort out. I also reindexed the rotary valve body on mine, which overcame routing of the fluid lines. It fits fine in my car, and uses the RB25 power steering pump. Most of all.....it WORKS! Cheers Jamo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Z Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Jamo240 do you have photos of the fabrication before you installed it? I wanted to also do the subaru rack but found very little info on how to actually make it all work. Many people speak about it, but don't really disclose fine details etc. Also pictures speak a thousand words and would definately help many people out. If you could give a few pointers on what tie rods/model rack you used etc i could buy it all, fab up something similar and do a tutorial on it. So Tai Do I take it you have the one in the photo in your hands? Cheers John No, not yet john just a pic i found online. Been doing some researching and the mx5/miata rack looks almost identical and very close in size the the mr2/240z rack aswell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamo240 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Hey Retro Happy to share what I know of the installation, including part numbers and all that. Pics and such are in my build thread....see link below. http://www.viczcar.com/forum/index.php/topic,9281.30.html Check out page 3 or so. I will chase up the details on the Subie rack I used (it wasn't wrx...I didn't use that as it had too few turns lock to lock....I wanted a little less rapid turn in, as with the R spec tyres I had the car was too darty, and the subie (I think might have been a Leonie...will confirm), it ended up with the same turns lock to lock as the OEM 240Z rack)...when I changed to Dunlop Direzza tyres, it is spot on...good turn in without being darty.) Tie rod ends are factory Subaru (once again, will confirm), and the inner tie rod ends are off a Toyota Lexus (I will advise model). It all bolts together without any mods. The rack itself needs to be shortened about 13mm each end (Rob at Robco engineering does that), and I also cut the ears off the rotary valve housing and reindexed them to a more suitable position for the fluid lines, which you will see in the pics work out quite well. Rob also did that at Robco and I have had no problems with any of that. The mods to the cross member were pretty straight forward....you have to take care with dimensional control to ensure the rack is centered and at the right height to avoid bump steer, but if you're taking on a job like this and can't fabricate, you'd be better to pay someone else to do the fab part. I will post the answers above when I have the info together...any other questions just ask. Cheers Jamo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KatoKid Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Jamo240 do you have photos of the fabrication before you installed it? I wanted to also do the subaru rack but found very little info on how to actually make it all work. Many people speak about it, but don't really disclose fine details etc. Also pictures speak a thousand words and would definately help many people out. If you could give a few pointers on what tie rods/model rack you used etc i could buy it all, fab up something similar and do a tutorial on it. Tai, pretty well everything you will need can be found here http://www.viczcar.com/forum/index.php/topic,7174.0.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nat0_240_chevZ Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 you can also use the aw11 rack, later PS model, and the ae86 corrolla PS on imports. Im also told there is a quite new/modern corolla you can use, abundance of availability, but yet to confirm. Nat0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Z Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Thanks for the help guys . Although i know how to fabricate I'm looking into finding the easiest fitting rack that will do the job with minor modifications to the crossmember for ease of engineering. I'm also looking into the possibility of buying several racks, tie rods and crossmembers. Getting the lines and machining all done at the one time to save on labour and R&D then sell them on as a bolt in package (for a very small profit) to the Z community. You could call it a public service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Exactly my thinking. Surely there has to be a rack out there that requires very minimal modification that just hasn't been discovered yet. I'm still keen to find out if the MR2 rack is indeed the rack that this guy in the US used, and if not, which one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.A.R. Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirpent Posted March 23, 2014 Author Share Posted March 23, 2014 Was wondering when you would chime in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.A.R. Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 People in this thread seem hell-bent on fixing the symptom (with the associated high cost) - not the cause, which is a completely backwards way to go about the issue of heavy steering in a S30 chassis. Read up on suspension geometry people & stop being sheep... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KatoKid Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Lurchos......agree this can be relatively high cost and probably hard to justify if you have to farm everthing out. My rack was $250, rack rod ends $140, Robco was very reasonably priced, engine came with a PS pump so I reckon all up the conversion including hoses will be less than $700. Ultimately its up to the individual but I'm looking to build a car that is a 70's car in look only, everything else has to be as contemporary as possible and drive like a modern car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Z Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Without knowing my car or its specs its abit premature to criticise why i may want power steering. My goal is somewhat similar to Katokids with the car having some of todays technology and reliability. For one i have 275 width tyres upfront, turbo engine with alot of heavy hardware over the front wheels. I will be driving it often on the street, shopping, stop/start traffic, city driving. I live in a concrete jungle where tight driveways are the norm..not somewhere with wide open roads. Having to maneuver the car out of my 4 car garage isn't the easiest of tasks. I will also be doing the odd track day and i want it easy for my missus to drive too. I know it may not be necessary but I've spent all this money on the thing another 1k won't hurt if its going to make it easier to live with. I'd just rather do the fab work myself rather than outsource because i feel like it and want to learn how to do it. Get with the times its not much more different to getting a efi rb25 or power windows. Don't be so precious people!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sirpent Posted March 23, 2014 Author Share Posted March 23, 2014 Seems I opened Pandora's box here, so would just like to pose a few questions Are we all suffering tall poppy syndrome here ? Isn't this a forum of learning, exploration and much unlike many forums I have visited one where diversity of thought has delivered innovation and solutions? Are a BMW or Subaru rack the last word and everything else just wishful thinking? I agree with Tai, loosen up people, if it fails it fails, and there wont be any need to say "I told you so" rather step up and say "Good F*cking Try" I will take my shirt off now and you can all aim those knives at the calluses on my back, I'm pretty thick skinned. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamo240 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I reckon it's great for people to try new things. There may indeed be other or better solutions. But, the Subie solution works. If you want a proven solution, use it. If not, pioneer something else. It's all cool. I don't think my Z needs power steering at speed....it doesn't. I run about a degree neg camber and a couple or so pos caster. Not crazy alignment by any stretch, but with 235/40R17 tyres, it is heavy to park. That was about the only problem I wanted to cure, as it made the car less fun at low speeds and parking...that's about it. The subie rack did the job I wanted done. Cheers boys....modifying cars is a bit like leggo...you can make whatever ya fink of! Jamo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 Wow, Kato, $700 is a pretty good price! I had been told that it would be much closer to the 2k region so I had rules it out until i read this thread. Well I've said my bit, I'll be keeping an eye on here just on the off chance that someone figures out something amazing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ledge Posted March 24, 2014 Share Posted March 24, 2014 I hadn't really considered PS for my Z but after the weekends Gymkhana having it would have been nice. I have not looked at the dimensions for comparison but I did have these links in my Z folder. Maybe one of you guys with the required measurements could check if they are usable http://www.flamingriver.com/index.php/products/c0014/s0010/FR40040 http://www.flamingriver.com/index.php/products/c0014/s0006/FR40023 http://www.flamingriver.com/index.php/products/c0014/s0006/FR40024 Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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