72 240Z with an L28 Fitted - Should I buy it?

Hi guys, I'm very new to forums and am about to buy my first Z!  I'm very excited and my wife thinks I am pathetic that I obsess so much about it.

I specifically wanted a 240Z that was complete.  My plan is to build one up with only minor changes.  I wanted to improve engine performance, modernise the brakes and steering a little but to retain the 240's character as much as possible.

After many months of travelling to look at Zeds and being asked for considerable funds to remove what was left of a (sometimes barley recognisable) Zed  from some blokes back yard, I have found one.

It's a 72 240Z.  Original colour is lime yellow that is now a very dodgy red.  Not a lot of discovered rust (prob plenty of it yet to be discovered!!)  It is complete (tierd but complete) and was running on the road until 4 years ago.

The thing is it is currently fitted with an L28 N/A and a 260 5 speed.

Are these mods that most people do anyway? Are L24's easy to find?  Should I bother changing engines?  Are the 28's much better than 24's? 

When I've finished restoring, I want a saleable asset (to fund the next one and because I've got the boss' consent only if it doesn't cost a fortune!!).

Should I keep looking or is this one a good start?

I'm not usually this wishy-washy, but I want to make sure I start off on the right foot. (or maybe my wife's right and I'm simply obsessed?)

Thanks Guys.

When I've finished restoring, I want a saleable asset (to fund the next one and because I've got the boss' consent only if it doesn't cost a fortune!!).

Hey MaygZ,

Depending on the condition of the car and how much the work you do costs and many other factors, you might be able to get back half of the money you put into restoring it on resale?

Photos would make it a lot easier for us to analyse the car. L28 with a 260 5 speed isn't necessarily a bad thing, its obviously not worth as much as having the original engine, but its very common for people to drop an L28 into their Z. It's probably got 240z twin SUs on it which are great carbys and even an amateur can recondition these.

The 260 5 speed is a sought after box because of its good ratios for racing applications. Search around the forum if you want more information on this topic.

I don't think anyone would bother changing back to a smaller engine unless you want slightly improved fuel economy or if you want to do historic racing? The L28 is very similar to the L24 except bored out and with a longer stroke IIRC.

You haven't really posted enough about the car for us to give you any specific advice. I would start by looking at all the information required by our for sale template and posting that information about this car you are looking at.

" When I've finished restoring, I want a saleable asset  "

No dont buy it.

Dont buy an enthusiast car if you are approaching it with this sort of attitude. You will never get your money back. And your " boss " will take one look at the initial investment V ROI and say that it is not a fiscally intelligent use of your money. If you see classic car ownership as a business venture that is.

I reckon flip a coin. Even if you do 90% of the work yourself those hours you spend still add up. I would say that the strongest reason that anyone has for restoring a Zed is Passion. It's never about logic as a lot spend more than the price of a new car.

Ahh, i still remember the very first Zed tearing down the road and with the help of these guys i've now commited to spending any spare money i can on parts from all corners of the globe because i have an image in my head of how i want My car to finally look and i douibt if i would ever sell it. None of the above is based on logic.

Thanks Guys,

I realise I haven't given you a great deal to go on.  I don't really have the access to the car to be able to give you all the details you require.

I have probably not expressed myself properly.    I am not interested in making money out of this adventure.  I am interested in emersing myself in something that challenges me and in the end gives me something that I can enjoy and be proud of.

I think that my obsession is my passion.  I am simply trying to balance my enthusiasm with your collective experiences and logic.

I never want to be one of those guys in the Trading Post who's ads read "Receipts for $40K sell for $8k."    I would simply like my Ad ( if there has to be one) to read more like Receipts for $20 sell for $20.  This is not a business for me.

I am not allowed to have more than one project, so if I want a second one, I need to not lose too much much money on the first.  I know that sounds a little cold, but that is my life.  Leys face it, She is funding half this project and She is looking at it without my emotion.  Surely I'm not the only bloke with this sort of input.

In the late 80's, 10 PW (pre wife) I rebuilt and raced an Alfa.  They were some of the best days of my life.  When I bought the Alfa I was tossing up between the Alfa, a Capri and a Zed.  I simply found the Alfa first.  The Alfa had to go for house renos.  The Renos are done, so back to the shed for me.

I sure that some of you guys who are lucky enough to own a 'Stable' of Zeds occasionally find yourselves thinking that if stuff hit the fan, atleast I could sell a Zed - or maybe they are your Super.  Selling a Zed surely can't be a sin.  If that were the case, then very few of you guys would have one (unless you bought it new).

The othre reason for asking the questions is I want to do some track work again.  Dose the L28 bugger me up for class.  Does it put me in a racing class with turbo monsters.  It would seem from Stevo that I would have more options with an L24.  Thank you Stevo.

Scootag.  I too have a dream of the look and fel I want from my Zed.  the problem is that with each post I read, it changes a little    It was always going to be red, but now I'm thinking the original colours are pretty good.  I initially wanted to drop a 5.0l V8 in, but now I want the original engine.  Reading the posts on this and other forums, is reshaping my dream constantly.

Now that you have most of my car CV ( I was a mechanic before I started flying in the mid 80's only to lose my job with the pilots dispute in 89!)

Hey MaygZ,

When you say receipts for $20K sell for $20K I'm afraid that's never going to happen with a Z. No one on this forum has restored a Z and then broke even upon selling it. I've spent about $20K on mine in the past year including purchase price, and its probably worth around $10K if I was to sell it.

Pretty much everyone I know IRL that races their Z with an L28. I would strongly suggest you do some research into what type of racing you want to do before you decide on changing to an L24, as you will more than likely end up racing in less strict categories since you don't have logbooks for the car etc.

Stevo,

I'm looking at MSCA sprints.  L24 puts me in a lower class than L26 or L28, and away from the 3.0/3.5 V8s.  It does mean racing small zippy little mx5's and the Alfettas/GTV's tho.  Swing and merry-go-rounds.

Fierce competition in MSCA? HAHAHAHA...

Hi Mate,

Welcome to the forums. Not sure if you have noticed but it's body work thats the killer on these Z's. Although getting harder to source L series and gearbox';s are fairly easy to come across. My tip to getting value for money is just find a car with as little rust as possible. If you have some skill with a MIG you can also save quite a few dollars and prep the car yourself. I have never kept track of how much money I have spent over the years on my car but my guess would be about $20k. Having said that it's by no means a show car but clean pretty much always running and best of great fun.

I reckon starting with the right car a ie $10K on a clean 240/260 2 seater and another $10K for some goodies assuming you keep the motor fairy stock and the car isn;t rust riddled.

Good luck, fixing up an old car especially a Z is alot of fun most of the time and we have a pretty good group of guys that meet up on a regular basis in Vic.  try and make it to our BBQ coming up in a few weeks and you will find plenty of nice Z's, advise from some really knowledgable Z guys that can save you dollars and time.

Cheers,

Sulio

http://www.viczcar.com/gallery/index.php?cat=10004

Thanks Toecutter.  Buying a Zed seems to be a step into the great unknown.  An absolute leap of faith.

My local panel boys are happy to teach me to MIG and let me use their gear 

The mechanics is just time and money for me.  Don't have either, but you always seem to find just enough of both to do the things you have to do.

My GOT you can buy some cool stuff from the US, but the postage would kill 

Thanks again for the welcome.

PS when and where are the BBQ?  I'm up near Kilmore.

Gav,

I'm wanting an asking price too.  The bloke is a bit of a hoarder and loves his Zeds.  He still has his first one he bought in 1974 sitting in a garage under stripped parts of lots of cars.  He must have at least 25 cars and 20 bikes in his back yard - everything from a Lanos to a Zender Kit 323i to V12 BMW.

The Zed I'm looking at was his daughter's, so he's poss a bit emo about it.

I'm trying to get there today.  Will try for some photos.  He's a bit funny about photos (understandably) with the value of things in his back yard.

I don't think he wants anyone to know he has 11 Zeds and has the parts from another 8 or 9 all over the place    I think he expects that he would then get hundreds of visitors wanting this and that part.

He intends to do up all the cars and bikes!!    None of us can really blame a bloke for dreaming, eh?

If finally got some photos.  It's amazing how much more rust you see when you take off the rose coloured glasses  :'(

And some more.  He has more doors, guards and hatches for me to choose from (buy).

Are the 2+2 hatches the same as the coupes?

sorry if the photos don't show it all.  Shart camera.

Yeah it looks a bit rusty, have you ever done rust work before? What was the price he gave you?

I couldn't see under the car as the tyres are flat, but the rails appear to be the best part of the car.  the driver's floor appears to have been fibreglassed.

Stevo I've not done rust work before.  I'm quite nervious about it to tell you the truth, but the local panel shop have said they will help.  I'm heading down there with the photos when I finish here to see what they reckon.

from what you've seen so far, any idea of a price?

there is a fair bit of rust around the rear hatch.  there is a fair bit in the wheel well, but none of is is yet through.  I suppose it would be by the time I took out what I can see  :-\

the driver's door looks pretty stuffed to me.  he has plenty of 2+2 doors, but that doesn't help me much.  he has a few coupe doors that he may part with.

The interior is all there.  the carpet is pretty shart tho.  The dash has a mat glued to it, so I am sure the dash top is stuffed.  he has a dash without a mark on it, but I doubt he will part with it.  He has others that are reasonably good with just one or two splits.

he is struggling to come up with a price and to be honest, I can't really think of a fair one either.  I'm thinking somewhere between $500 and $2000.  But I really don't know.

he will obviously make more money out of me for parts 

Do you have any ideas?

If I had to take a stab I'd say it's probably worth around a grand.

It's got the potential to cost a lot of money to fix that body. Does it have to be this car? You might be able to find one with a better condition body for a couple grand more up front that would save you heaps in the long run.

Body repairs are one of those things for which you will never see a great deal of return on your money. IMO you'd have to spend at least $10K to get this car in half decent shape.

I'm far from an expert, so see what everyone else has to say.

I'd have to agree with Steve, this one looks terminal, rust is like an iceburg, you only see 30% of it, the other 70% is below the surface that you cant see, even tell tail signs like the upper front screen turret section corner which is factory lead loaded at the panel join, in your pic its lifting which means one of 2 things, "A" the rust is so bad the lead is delaminating which, or "B" it's been bogged to bugary in the past when the car went to red from the original lime / yellow color which meant it was probably hemraging rust even then.

The pic with the inner drivers door frame just in shot shows pretty nasty rust holes, thats a raer spot for them to start a rust cancer trip, if its that bad there, it will only get worse as you head south to the lower body reaches.

If you could nab it for $500, at least even at worst if you did strip it down and find its all terminal you could salvage the investment you made, but any more would be a lost cause.

Sorry Buddy, and dont take the opinion badly, we all try to look out for each other here.

Cheers

John

he has a 260 2 seater in MUCH better condition.  Is has a small amount of collision damage to the front left; and I mean small.  Now I'm wandering if I should skip the 240 dream and go with a 260 dream

For me the 260 would be second prize.  I emphasise that is for ME.

but second is much better than last.

he has a Deawoo 

The bugger has a GTO kit and he has a G nose he's like the Steptoe (or catweasel, depending on your age) of Zeds!!

Go for the minor impacted one !

At worst even if it has skirt / Rad Support damage you can always find an untoched doner 2+2 assy and have it unplucked and welded on.

If its a ridgy didge G-Nose "GRAB IT !"

I think that last shot you posted tells it all as far as the 240Z