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!!!SOLVED!!! Wilwoods on rear keep locking up first!


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Hey looking for some advice on my locking rears

 

Im going through eningeering and the discs on the back are locking up before the fronts. Engineer wont be happy. Have tried a prop valve but its still biting first. Any ideas/suggestions guys?

 

 

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Just a few thoughts:

 

Is the proportioning valve plumbed the correct way? Screw it in the opposite rotation and see what happens.

 

Can it be set to 'fully disengaged'? If you got it from Arizona Z let me know and I'll visually inspect mine (still in the packet after 4 years!) to see if it can.

 

Are the 'fronts' fully bled? How close to the M/C is the proportioning valve?

 

What M/C are you using? Make sure it doesn't have a built-in proportioning valve.

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You also need to be sure the ratio of front/rear piston diameters is within the authority of the prop valve...by that I mean the prop valve does not have infinite ability to reduce the pressure to the rears to nothing, so if youre front/rear ratios are too far out by design (ie rear pistons are too big), the prop valve may not be able to reduce the pressure enough. In that case, you either need larger diameter pistons at the front, or smaller at the rear. I had the opposite problem on mine originally...when I had VS Commorodore rear calipers (36mm dia), no matter how much pressure i fed them I could not lock up the rears, so I went to VT calipers (44mm dia), and then I could. From there, i could use the prop valve to balance them up so i have the fronts locking first.

 

Cheers

 

 

Jamo

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Thanks guys, its a arizona z car prop valve yeah. Im using a 15/16 master cylinder off a 280zx i think.

 

I have the 4 piston calipers all round (dynalite + superlite). The fronts are visibly larger but both 4 piston.

Prop valve is on the rear line a few feet from the m/c

 

NOt 100% on bleeds or if it has a prop built in.

 

 

 

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The Wilwood + Wilwood has been fitted many many times so it might be worthwhile to look on HybridZ to see if this issue has been raised and solutions offered. I can't offer a specific thread but see if 'search' offers up something.

 

What are you doing for a handbrake?

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Yeah that was my next stop. Handrake has been based on woz's kit of using a spot caliper and custom mounting plate/handbrake cable. It works ok, but will be useless if i need other rears....

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I've just dug out my proportioning valve and it still has seals on the ports and knowing the rate of progress on my project (it could be another four years before it gets fitted!) I don't want to break the seals just yet... apologies. It may not have been much help anyway but at least you could have checked if your front are working properly.

 

(edit) The Wilwood web site indicates that you can only alter the rate from 0 to 57% so you can't block off the rears completely.

http://www.wilwood.com/MasterCylinders/MasterCylinderProd.aspx?itemno=260-8419

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So the adjustable prop valve didnt work well enough, so now my only other idea is to get rid of the stock prob valve all together and see what happens.

if this fails, it looks like a r31 rear replacement:( for engineer rego

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If you are using a combination that is well proven on other people's cars, I would look a little further before replacing anything else. Why don't you get a couple of brake hose clamps (available from tool shops) and clamp the rear lines off at the calipers and make sure you can actually lock the fronts up at all. It would be good to diagnose which part isn't working before changing anything else.

 

Cheers

 

Jamo

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Yeah I am waiting for a reply from the seller in USA but removing the stock prop valve may be the answer. Its not that anything isnt working properly, its just the rears are too powerful.

 

Will find out in a few days

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This is a common occurrence with the wilwood setup from AZC.

 

Even when running a bias with all fronts and zero back you will still find a problem.

 

A lot of the guys up here have ended up running a 1" cylinder and smaller rear pads so you can still have some adjustment with the bias.

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OK something you probably never considered.

What is the toe in on your rear wheels. Have they ever been adjusted to with in .5 of a deg. I they are out 5-7 deg then yes you will lock up every time when running the car hard. As I used to on the track. Sure I put the brake bias in and it worked great. But after I aligned the rear wheels the problem was solved and now my front to rear brake bias has not been used in 8-10 years.

Just something else to consider.

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Thanks for all the suggestions fellas. I took the car out to get a quote for paint and panel yesterda, but will be back at the mechanics tommorrow to sort this issue out. All the ideas thrown out are plausable and will be used until a resolution is found.  The nipple and orientated in the correct position. I think what we will do is ensure the fronts can lock up but isolating line. After that, new softer pads on rear. Swap lines (front - back from MC) and adjust toe/camber etc. When I purchased the brades off AZC I also got the 3 way adjustable coilovers so maybe thats thrown the angles out slightly aswell....

 

On a good note, quoted $4-5k paint/panel/replace all weatherstrips and reassemble....

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I took the z out for a spin out to Braidwood and met Dave (Dingo Dave) from the forum. He has all facilities out on Station Rd and owns a 260 2+2.

That also includes smoothing rear end (removing bumper) and a month turn around.

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Ok so in order to elimate the AZC Willwood rear brakes issue this is whats required.

 

Install adjust prop valve from kit

 

Remove stock prop valve from near m/c

 

And its all done!! I took it for a spin and fronts lock up everytime now. Cannot operate with two valves. I even think its stopping harder and faster than before, which is saying something considering the brakes were great before.

 

Thanks for all your help and advice guys, love this forum!

 

When are the nationals and where? Are any ACT zedders making a convoy?

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