Hello Aub!
Why not, just keep it all Z centric, do like all other single model clubs do, agree to meet at a central location that suits all ( watch for the arguments on that one!) just gather at a local park, lift bonnets, go Ooh Aahh a lot, than have a dinner, tjen go for a drive on some nice country roads, not too rough though, dont want paint chips on the trailer queens.
Forget any competition, sprints lapdash, hillclimb, etc etc, as that is consideted too risky to a clubs finances, nowadays!
As low event entrant (Z cars only) numbers will make the risk of track hire anywhere, to cost prohibitive, and, lack of CAMS officials within a club, along with the manpowere required to run events, will negate it.
A loose AASA run event, tacked on the back of a pre-existing AASA organised event, could satisfy the mine's fastwr than your's brigade.
There is no reason at all that a Z only Nationals could be run, at any time, considering the plethora of Jap based car shows/events etc tjat are held all over the country these days.
FUTURE Z CAR NATIONALS
Started By
be-zed
, Oct 06 2011 02:34 PM
67 replies to this topic
#41
dat2kman
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Posted 07 February 2012 - 01:11 PM
#42
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Posted 07 February 2012 - 06:42 PM
A purely Zed events is a nice idea however the challenge will be to find people willing to organise it ............having been on event committees for the past three NDSOC hosted nationals ( and the next coming up in 2013) , I know level of effort required ...........even a "Knob Polishing" event and a social drive/nav rally takes considerable organisation. And then there is the financials (trophies, booking venues etc) .
Al.
Al.
#43
be-zed
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 10:25 AM
You still chewing that bone Jason . Can not be much meat left on it by now.
It seems that almost everyone who has replied to this thread has at some point been involved in at least one National event at some level. So we know it can be done . Cost is not a real issue ,it is a matter of value for money for what can be organised. Getting the organizers on the same page is another issue. With that done everthing thing after should fall into place. Having said that we all know its a good feeling when its over .I do not believe this kind of event should be left to die .Even if it is just a few lap dashes and a knob polishing event. I feel both the NDN type events and Z Nats should have a place in our calendars. ZCCQ will look at this issue in up coming meetings.
It seems that almost everyone who has replied to this thread has at some point been involved in at least one National event at some level. So we know it can be done . Cost is not a real issue ,it is a matter of value for money for what can be organised. Getting the organizers on the same page is another issue. With that done everthing thing after should fall into place. Having said that we all know its a good feeling when its over .I do not believe this kind of event should be left to die .Even if it is just a few lap dashes and a knob polishing event. I feel both the NDN type events and Z Nats should have a place in our calendars. ZCCQ will look at this issue in up coming meetings.
#44
dat2kman
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:16 AM
No bone chewing here, simple math, when Z car club Qld gets charged $12000 a day for use of a track in 2011, you need a lot of Zeds to make it pay, or just charge the 30 or 40 that "might" turn up $400 or $300 each for half a dozen 20 minute sprint sessions, then add on top all the other costs for a Zed centred get together.You still chewing that bone Jason . Can not be much meat left on it by now.
It seems that almost everyone who has replied to this thread has at some point been involved in at least one National event at some level. So we know it can be done . Cost is not a real issue ,it is a matter of value for money for what can be organised. Getting the organizers on the same page is another issue. With that done everthing thing after should fall into place. Having said that we all know its a good feeling when its over .I do not believe this kind of event should be left to die .Even if it is just a few lap dashes and a knob polishing event. I feel both the NDN type events and Z Nats should have a place in our calendars. ZCCQ will look at this issue in up coming meetings.
Hence the suggestion of jst do a show and shine, go for drive meet, like majority of other single model types do.
When a committee starts to get the jitters over the possible financial risks to the healthy bank balance of staging an event that is targeted at a wider audience, thus ensuring a greater level of success, as was mooted for middle of this year, under CAMS authority, and adopt a negative stance, then there cant be too much in it for any other events to be considered in a positive light. Basic back of envelope figures showed the mooted event would have paid for itself, plus bring new membetship, as well as positive multi club exposure.
Sure not a Nationals, but, are the Nationals, as a concept, dying?
#45
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 04:34 PM
This is getting very confusing. A far as sprint days go we had the hugely successful LapZ which was basically a 'Z and friends' day, as with any sprint event these days there are not enough Z participants in Q to make a Z exclusive sprint viable. That is obvious. It should be noted that a lot of the burden of organising LapZ fell on Dusty, as far as I know since then noone has stepped forward and volunteered to organise another LapZ so it should be pretty obvious, again, what bringing an event into being requires.
As it is in Q there are heaps of car related events already, they are on all the time so there is no lack of opportunity for anyone in the ZCCQ to put their hand up and organise something. But I'm sort of glad things are as they are, so much freedom of choice. If anyone wants to be organised and hand fed then join the Kraut Klub
As it is in Q there are heaps of car related events already, they are on all the time so there is no lack of opportunity for anyone in the ZCCQ to put their hand up and organise something. But I'm sort of glad things are as they are, so much freedom of choice. If anyone wants to be organised and hand fed then join the Kraut Klub
#46
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 04:54 PM
The other thing that someone could 'complain' about is Z attendance at Lakeside sprints, that's if someone wanted something to complain about. Lakeside has to be the fastest and most challenging short track in Oz. Yet the only regular S30 sprinter there is Neville M in his hybrid S30, plus there is the occasional NON ZCCQ MEMBER 280ZX and 300ZX. It has me buggered why more Z cars are not right into Lakeside, it really has.
#47
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 06:07 PM
I played last year at Lakeside in the top gear series, when are you guys going to have a go at real racing in prodsports?
??
??
#48
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 06:19 PM
The 97 Zed Nats used the lakeside circuit for the sprint and it was brilliant..............a shame we did not get to go back there in 2009.
Getting back to the subject, Jason has hit the nail on the head (as was stated earlier) ..............the number of Zeds do not add up to a cost effective event. The Roadster clubs hold an annual Nationals and confine it to a "Knob Polishing" display and follow the leader type drive and a weekend chat fest............ as most of the Roadster fraternity are "knob polishers" and track shy so the lack of a sprint event does not worry most.
IMHO .........I think a Zed nationals without a track event would be a fizzer, hence why we must have combined events to keep them financialy vialble.
Al.
Getting back to the subject, Jason has hit the nail on the head (as was stated earlier) ..............the number of Zeds do not add up to a cost effective event. The Roadster clubs hold an annual Nationals and confine it to a "Knob Polishing" display and follow the leader type drive and a weekend chat fest............ as most of the Roadster fraternity are "knob polishers" and track shy so the lack of a sprint event does not worry most.
IMHO .........I think a Zed nationals without a track event would be a fizzer, hence why we must have combined events to keep them financialy vialble.
Al.
#49
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 07:34 PM
When a committee starts to get the jitters over the possible financial risks to the healthy bank balance of staging an event that is targeted at a wider audience, thus ensuring a greater level of success, as was mooted for middle of this year, under CAMS authority, and adopt a negative stance, then there cant be too much in it for any other events to be considered in a positive light. Basic back of envelope figures showed the mooted event would have paid for itself, plus bring new membetship, as well as positive multi club exposure.
Sure not a Nationals, but, are the Nationals, as a concept, dying?
Good to see you don't like to divluge the full story Jason, At the meeting last year when the event at Morgan Park was discussed, of course the financial risk was apart of the discussion, but why don't you mention what the REAL reason the event was squashed?
I asked those who were at the meeting (and the were a lot of committe and non committe members there all up about 20+ ) who would be willing to put there hand up to help you organise this type event, and apart from you Jason, how many people were willing to volunteer there time to help you?
For those who weren't at the meeting it was a BIG F@#$ing 0 and i know! you cant organise an event like that without help,
So why don't you stop saying that we have a negative stance or the jitters , just because the event at Morgan Park over the Queens Birthday event was something that You! personally wanted to do, and we as a club did not vote to support it. Because lets face it nobody was willing to volunteer there time to help you . So GET OVER IT!!! and move on. If you think the event would be a goer, and you defiantly have the financial means to back this type of event, why haven't you got an event going and organised it yourself? Let lets face it, Dusty with help from Aub and only a small amount of help from me, was able to do LapZ 2 years running. Stop bitching and organise an event yourself!!!
Regarding the Future of the Nationals, if enough ZCCQ members are willing to volunteer there time to run a Nationals in whatever format, i cant see why it wont happen. But lets face it if nobody from the ZCCQ is willing to volunteer there time to organise a Nationals then i guess we wont be doing it!
#50
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 08:18 PM
Time to set the record straight .
This is the financial for the last 2 LAPZ events held at Lakeside . 2010 was a standard street sprint day on the QUEENSLAND RACING calendar . We booked three groups of 20 runners at $1750 per group at a cost of $100 per entrant.This for a total number of four runs of five laps each. Because their were so many of us all 6 groups on the day were of 20 runners each . This was to much for their timing systems to deal with on the day. With the left over funds we purchased base ball caps and stickers of the day for each entrant.
2011 we were asked to book our own day for the club . But rules had changed , it was now three hours of private practice and four hours of timed runs. We were offered 6 groups of 15 runners at $2000 a group. But with some arm twisting a deal was struck at $10000 for the whole day . We were allowed 75 cars in all but could only attract just over 63 on the day. The cost was set at a $160 per car which just covered costs . So we organised sponsors for hand outs on the day from Silverstone Tyres ,Autobarn and others . Also you could get a hot Breakfast and 1/2 Hour of paced track time for $20 on the morning of the day. All of entrance fees we charged were well below what a private entry fee is for a street Sprint with private practice.
How do I know this. Because I organised it.
This is the financial for the last 2 LAPZ events held at Lakeside . 2010 was a standard street sprint day on the QUEENSLAND RACING calendar . We booked three groups of 20 runners at $1750 per group at a cost of $100 per entrant.This for a total number of four runs of five laps each. Because their were so many of us all 6 groups on the day were of 20 runners each . This was to much for their timing systems to deal with on the day. With the left over funds we purchased base ball caps and stickers of the day for each entrant.
2011 we were asked to book our own day for the club . But rules had changed , it was now three hours of private practice and four hours of timed runs. We were offered 6 groups of 15 runners at $2000 a group. But with some arm twisting a deal was struck at $10000 for the whole day . We were allowed 75 cars in all but could only attract just over 63 on the day. The cost was set at a $160 per car which just covered costs . So we organised sponsors for hand outs on the day from Silverstone Tyres ,Autobarn and others . Also you could get a hot Breakfast and 1/2 Hour of paced track time for $20 on the morning of the day. All of entrance fees we charged were well below what a private entry fee is for a street Sprint with private practice.
How do I know this. Because I organised it.
#51
be-zed
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 08:30 PM
This has to stop .
Good luck with NDN13 VIC.
Good luck with NDN13 VIC.
#52
dat2kman
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 10:08 PM
No it doesnt, Davey, check with Dusty, the outlay and with payment toQR to use Lakeside for the last Lapz was what $12,000, the club got in $12,500, and no cams permits, no medical intervention unit costs, no donation to the flaggies cost.
WDSCC hire MP at approx third the cost, plus the extras, thats why i reckoned it would work, but, and others will confirm, there is a little group in the club that dont like the idea of risking the bank account.
Nothing ventured nothing gained!
By all means use Lakeside, but why not buy a few blocks, rather than the whole lot, tag onto an existing sprints calendered weekend, use that as a pure Zed based get together. It is a no brainer to go AASA and use Lakeside, far less hassle, just have to make sure that 100 zeds turn up!
Using AASA and QR to do all the Lapz entry papetwork, forms, timing drivers briefing, is easy, but you pay for this, whereas at Mor Park, the club has to be behind it, and quite clearly the financial risk did play a part in negating a All Jap multi day, multi event weekend..
WDSCC hire MP at approx third the cost, plus the extras, thats why i reckoned it would work, but, and others will confirm, there is a little group in the club that dont like the idea of risking the bank account.
Nothing ventured nothing gained!
By all means use Lakeside, but why not buy a few blocks, rather than the whole lot, tag onto an existing sprints calendered weekend, use that as a pure Zed based get together. It is a no brainer to go AASA and use Lakeside, far less hassle, just have to make sure that 100 zeds turn up!
Using AASA and QR to do all the Lapz entry papetwork, forms, timing drivers briefing, is easy, but you pay for this, whereas at Mor Park, the club has to be behind it, and quite clearly the financial risk did play a part in negating a All Jap multi day, multi event weekend..
#53
dat2kman
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Posted 10 February 2012 - 10:19 PM
Wonderfull diatribe from a club president!
Very positive! Forward looking too!
At least someone is prepared to stick a neck out and have a go at trying something.....
And is passionate enough to push for it, and it did have some support, not as stated as below!!
Very positive! Forward looking too!
At least someone is prepared to stick a neck out and have a go at trying something.....
And is passionate enough to push for it, and it did have some support, not as stated as below!!
Good to see you don't like to divluge the full story Jason, At the meeting last year when the event at Morgan Park was discussed, of course the financial risk was apart of the discussion, but why don't you mention what the REAL reason the event was squashed?
I asked those who were at the meeting (and the were a lot of committe and non committe members there all up about 20+ ) who would be willing to put there hand up to help you organise this type event, and apart from you Jason, how many people were willing to volunteer there time to help you?
For those who weren't at the meeting it was a BIG F@#$ing 0 and i know! you cant organise an event like that without help,
So why don't you stop saying that we have a negative stance or the jitters , just because the event at Morgan Park over the Queens Birthday event was something that You! personally wanted to do, and we as a club did not vote to support it. Because lets face it nobody was willing to volunteer there time to help you . So GET OVER IT!!! and move on. If you think the event would be a goer, and you defiantly have the financial means to back this type of event, why haven't you got an event going and organised it yourself? Let lets face it, Dusty with help from Aub and only a small amount of help from me, was able to do LapZ 2 years running. Stop bitching and organise an event yourself!!!
Regarding the Future of the Nationals, if enough ZCCQ members are willing to volunteer there time to run a Nationals in whatever format, i cant see why it wont happen. But lets face it if nobody from the ZCCQ is willing to volunteer there time to organise a Nationals then i guess we wont be doing it!
#54
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Posted 11 February 2012 - 07:28 AM
There are a fair few people in the club Jason who had experience with organising the last Nats at Morgan Park, whatever was said as far as I can tell being involved again in organising a Nat type event was the main problem. Being involved in organising a Nats type event simply burns the limited number of organisers available out.
Personally as far as circuits go I can't see that MP has any advantage over Lakeside at all and, as has been demonstrated with LapZ, the organising aspect is greatly reduced although it is still considerable. So your event stands a better chance of being a goer at Lakeside Jason. Go with the flow mate.
Personally as far as circuits go I can't see that MP has any advantage over Lakeside at all and, as has been demonstrated with LapZ, the organising aspect is greatly reduced although it is still considerable. So your event stands a better chance of being a goer at Lakeside Jason. Go with the flow mate.
#55
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Posted 11 February 2012 - 08:14 AM
Who??? not one put there hand up at the 2 meetings i was at where the Morgan Park long weekend was discussed.and it did have some support, not as stated as below!!
#56
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Posted 18 February 2012 - 09:13 AM
Hey Guys,
Not to take away from the discussion, but I'm trying to make plans for a visit for the nationals next year and was wondering if any planning had started. Read the thread and it looks a bit bleak, but if it went ahead, any idea on WHEN it might go ahead?
Last time (2007) I was able to tie the trip in with the PI historics, so I left the car and just flew over twice in the month. Something like that again would seal the deal for me to make another trip to a great event.
I hope the event doesn't die, I know my dad and I had a HUGE time in 2007 coming across the plain to see and meet everyone.
Not to take away from the discussion, but I'm trying to make plans for a visit for the nationals next year and was wondering if any planning had started. Read the thread and it looks a bit bleak, but if it went ahead, any idea on WHEN it might go ahead?
Last time (2007) I was able to tie the trip in with the PI historics, so I left the car and just flew over twice in the month. Something like that again would seal the deal for me to make another trip to a great event.
I hope the event doesn't die, I know my dad and I had a HUGE time in 2007 coming across the plain to see and meet everyone.
#57
be-zed
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Posted 20 February 2012 - 01:55 PM
The thread is not bleak , just a little head butting going on . Nothing to worry about.
NDSOC will host the next NDN in 2013 .What this topic is about is what form they will take in the future .At present the NDN's are hosted to a degree (around 75%) by Z based car clubs and the NDSOC. All eastern sea board clubs.There is no reason why they could not be hosted in SOUTH AUST or Western Australia. The Eastern Sea board states now have 3 to 4 events each under their belts . So the appeal to attend for some members is not so high any more. But an event held in the other States. Now that would have appeal. Imagine 70+ Z's together across the plains at the same time or 300+ Nissan -Datsuns .It would have to be a photo from space . Or put us all on the train to Perth . That could be a party. There is also no reason it has to be held at Easter.
NDSOC will host the next NDN in 2013 .What this topic is about is what form they will take in the future .At present the NDN's are hosted to a degree (around 75%) by Z based car clubs and the NDSOC. All eastern sea board clubs.There is no reason why they could not be hosted in SOUTH AUST or Western Australia. The Eastern Sea board states now have 3 to 4 events each under their belts . So the appeal to attend for some members is not so high any more. But an event held in the other States. Now that would have appeal. Imagine 70+ Z's together across the plains at the same time or 300+ Nissan -Datsuns .It would have to be a photo from space . Or put us all on the train to Perth . That could be a party. There is also no reason it has to be held at Easter.
#58
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Posted 21 February 2012 - 06:53 AM
Guys
Be assured that the 2013 NDN will go ahead as planned, the NDSOC has the committee (and the financials) committed to organising a great event, at this stage we are aiming for a format as per 2007 ............the challenge at the moment is getting P.I to lock in our request for the track which they will not do until end of this year.
And yes I agree it would be great to see another state host an event (SA where are you??) .............I think WA would be great however the distance will be the real challenge in attracting East coast entries.
cheers
Al.
Lifer
NDSOC
Be assured that the 2013 NDN will go ahead as planned, the NDSOC has the committee (and the financials) committed to organising a great event, at this stage we are aiming for a format as per 2007 ............the challenge at the moment is getting P.I to lock in our request for the track which they will not do until end of this year.
And yes I agree it would be great to see another state host an event (SA where are you??) .............I think WA would be great however the distance will be the real challenge in attracting East coast entries.
cheers
Al.
Lifer
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#59
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Posted 07 June 2012 - 09:45 AM
Guys
Good news
The NDSOC committee have secured Phillip Island for the 2013 Nationals, format at this stage will be the same as 2007
Commencing Friday 29th March 2013
Good Friday - registration and welcome BBQ (evening)
Sat - P.I Sprint (with a navigation rally/cruise for those not into track stuff)
Sunday Concourse along the Cowes foreshore .
Monday - fareweel breakfast
A big thanks to the the hard work put in by Karyn (VP NDSOC) for negotiating with P.I management.
The NDSOC will now be putting a subcommittee together to start on the detailed planning of the event (there is much to do in the next 10 months), for anyone wanting to assist please contact me .
cheers
Alan
lifer
NDSOC
Good news
The NDSOC committee have secured Phillip Island for the 2013 Nationals, format at this stage will be the same as 2007
Commencing Friday 29th March 2013
Good Friday - registration and welcome BBQ (evening)
Sat - P.I Sprint (with a navigation rally/cruise for those not into track stuff)
Sunday Concourse along the Cowes foreshore .
Monday - fareweel breakfast
A big thanks to the the hard work put in by Karyn (VP NDSOC) for negotiating with P.I management.
The NDSOC will now be putting a subcommittee together to start on the detailed planning of the event (there is much to do in the next 10 months), for anyone wanting to assist please contact me .
cheers
Alan
lifer
NDSOC
#60
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Posted 07 June 2012 - 01:24 PM
Awesome news Alan! Now I have something to aim for!!
And thanks to NDSOC for their efforts.
And thanks to NDSOC for their efforts.
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