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FUTURE Z CAR NATIONALS


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#21 Sirpent

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Posted 10 October 2011 - 10:46 AM

Easter weekend 2013 Johhno
Enough notice to pull your finger out?  :P


Out cleaned and manicured already Simon..............

Kato- David and I and I'm pretty sure Loui have already made a pact via PM to be there.

#22 be-zed

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Posted 10 October 2011 - 12:29 PM

It seems the future of Z nationals is dead . So be it .
I find this sad as other Nissan Datsun Marques have there own Nationals .The Sporties and Skylines are but two.I must admit the thought that a Z owner would boycot a Z National event  because it was not a Nissan-Datsun event never entered my mind at the first Z Nats in 1990.
But things change and making sure it is good change is the hard part . Alan will have his hands full with NDN13, been there done that.So to add to some of the good ideas that are already on this thread . The Nissan-Datsun Nationals need to be standardize. A set of rules that can be followed by other hosting States or(ACT) Territories.These need to be as simple as possible and must be fair to all models of the Marque. They have to be broad enough to take in possible future models. For example classes by age pre 60,70,80 etc and CC for motorsport event.
Concourse along the same lines and rules.
Easter does not always have to be the date for Nationals .It was something I used in 1990 because it suited me. To take change to an other level. Perhaps the event can be broaden to include events like DRIFTING and a TARGA style tarmac event. These 2 events are very big with nissan owners of all makes. We did have a navigation event in 1990 and I remember it well as I broke my foot on the course.
This would also involve extending the the numbers of competition days from two to four days .I would also lengthen the duration of Nationals from two (2) years to four (4) years.
No one really has an interest in World championships which are held every year . But a world cup Rugby or Soccer um Football or Commonwealth Games and the Olympics. They are events you make time to be at as you may only get one shot to attend.
To cover the cost of Hosting  such a festival would involve input on a National level . This would also commit the other States to advertise the event and make sure there were adequate numbers attending .Shares could sold to other Nissan clubs to raise funds to cover upfront costs and deposits to acquire venues .I am sure there would be a wealth of information on how to run these events in the membership of other clubs .   

#23 sco_aus

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Posted 10 October 2011 - 01:14 PM

I don't really like the idea of the navagation events personally, I wouldn't drive 8 hours to drive a road I can drive any time for free.  The idea of something like PI which is an epic track in it's own right and to only see it once every 6 years excites me. I realize I can go there more often than that, but since it is 8 hours away, I simply can't afford it... 

I dont think the Nats will die, I think people just need to relax and get over the us vs them thing and try and enjoy it, rather than fight it.

#24 Sirpent

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Posted 10 October 2011 - 01:48 PM

Be-Zed

Have to be honest and put a couple of observations forward be they right or wrong, most Zed owners are enthusiasts but seem to run their cars on a shoe string budget which also extends to their ability to sacrifice time and funds to extra ordinary events, there is no doubting the love we all have for our cars, but unlike many more expensive marques, the cost of commitment is I feel to great for some.

I agree that a 4 day event is the way to go so as to be able to make it more enticing to everyone with a variety of events be they in the form of participation or exhibition, more bang for your buck so to say, it also allows some potential attendees the chance to choose what day or days they may wish to attend based on their interests.

However, and please tell me if I'm wrong, these events to date have been light on with regard to 3rd party sponsorship from what I can gather? and if this is the case, this is one of the areas I would be concentrating on also.

I say this because no matter how many clubs are involved, the risk of blowing budgets is always great and as a result limits financing anything other than purely vehicle related activities and events, if on the other hand, a more family friendly event could be arranged where our significant others and offspring also gained benefit from attending, the numbers and also spend by participants could be much higher.







#25 be-zed

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Posted 10 October 2011 - 07:06 PM

There is no way I would suggest that PI be dropped in favour of a rally. I personally have not run at PI but would love to .Guys from the QLD Club say it has to be experience or your life will not be fulfilled. I am just putting forward add two events which seem to be of interest to Nissan datsun owners. Drifting in QLD is big going by the entries at the paper clip raceway. The ratio is about 8:1 for Nissan's to other makes. I am hopeless at drifting .I just seem to break things and Iam tired of changing gear boxes and diffs along with bent exhaust valves.But it does make a good spectator sport . Theres nothing  like the smell of burning clutch um rubber to brigthen up your day.

Sponsorship is a difficult subject . It is all about timing . You will find that only 1 in a 100 organizations will part with cash for this type of event. However it may be around 1 in 10 that will part with product. How this product is used to cover costs is up to the organizers . As an example the QLD Club celebrated the 40th anniversary of the 240Z with sponsorship from Nissan Australia. No money changed hands but about $2000 worth of product was on hand .Everyone who entered received something and a pewter keyring for every club member. Nissan had no interest in our LAPZ event but Autobarn, Silverstone and others did .Once again every one who entered received something and we had Raffles to cover costs.
Sirpent your observation are correct and I am one of them . This is why most entrants to these type of events make a final decision to enter more than 12 months out from the event . It is important to get the message out there early. Qld Z is sending two groups to PI for the relay event in August 2012 . Whos going was made 2 months ago.This why there was a very poor showing from QLD Z Club at the 2011. The message was to late.

#26 MaygZ

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Posted 10 October 2011 - 08:14 PM

.... a more family friendly event could be arranged where our significant others and offspring also gained benefit from attending, the numbers and also spend by participants could be much higher.


Yeah!!!  PENGUINS!!!!

#27 sco_aus

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Posted 10 October 2011 - 08:15 PM

mmmm.... Penguins......

#28 Sirpent

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Posted 10 October 2011 - 09:02 PM

Welcome back Simon, nice to see you take the sting out of a serious discussion.

Back to the serious stuff though.

Years ago I was involved with a National league club, (no we wont go there google search to find out more) and I came up with an idea which we pitched at Ford Australia, you are right when you say that a company like Nissan wont part with cash, but what they will part with is product at if it is cash neutral.

Ford Holden Nissan and every maker have internal pricing for their products, in other words, retail, dealer and promotional, the latter being barely above production cost, and they can allocate these prices to vehicles when they are being used for promotional reasons.

So, being 2 years out, it would be worthwhile speaking to their marketing team and asking if a deal could be done where 2 vehicles would be supplied for raffle purposes, lets say the retail value of a 370Z and a smaller passenger vehicle was $100K, their promotional internal cost would probably be 60-70% of that, so you get them supplied for lets say $70K, sell raffle tickets over the next 2 years at $2.00 a pop, rake in $100K, hand over $70k to Nissan, net $30K towards the event.

Theres more than one way to skin a cat.


#29 luvemfast

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Posted 10 October 2011 - 09:32 PM

I like the way you think there John.
What are the costs involved to run a raffle like that though? (licensing and promo)
And a gamble that you could actually sell 50,000 tickets.

#30 1600dave

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Posted 10 October 2011 - 11:23 PM

The main thing I took from this year's nationals was that all details need to be finalised and promoted much further out from the event than it was. People won't commit without something concrete, and getting the needed info only a month or two out from the event was just too late. I personally know a few people who didn't attend for just this reason.

It can be an expensive undertaking to drive to another state for a few days - people need to plan, time to save, time to book holidays, etc.

One thing that I feel really adds value is an alternative event organised on the day that the track day is run. Not everyone will put their car on the track, so a navigational run or even just a drive / cruise to local points of interest will give those people something to do for that day (or for the rest of the family for those who do hit the track). The 2007 nationals were great in this regard, having everone end up at the track for a few parade laps at lunchtime was really good.



#31 260Coupe

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 07:31 AM

Dave

you are spot on ............we have found that not all want to blast around the track hence why I planned the Nav Rally as an alternate event for 2007, also the track entry was capped at 100 entrants (from memory) so we had to plan for an alternative event for those who may have missed it.
The morning nav rally with over sixty entrants ended with a couple of parade laps around the P.I circuit..........which was a highlight for those who had not driven the circuit before.
The 2001 Nationals held in Sheparton also had a third competition day where we held a motokhana on the skid pan at Deca (Sunday was the track day with an alternate touring drive of the local country side and wineries).............unfortunately Sheparton is out for the foreseeable future due to the Easter Nats moving to Winton.

So it is my view that you must cater for all with a variety of events.........some like the Show n Shine, others a nav rally/touring drive........others are into track events.
The last three of the NDSOC hosted Nats have catered for all tastes and next year wll be no different.

Al.

 

#32 Gordo

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 08:11 PM

  For those of you thinking about doing this event, don't think about it just do it.  I was at 2001 and 2007 and I can tell you it will be the best Easter you will ever have. Doing the hole weekend with the family was fantastic, we all loved it. You all have heaps of time to get those cars ready and put a bit of money aside. From memory there would have been over 40 zeds lining the beach promenade, more zeds in the one place than I have ever seen in my life. So for the zed lovers there is plenty there. For me one of the high lights was all Nissan and Datsuns together. It was like a kid in a candy store looking into all the engine bays, paint jobs , brake's etc. Not to mention a few hot laps around the Island. It is a must do. I don't care what some of you guys say about the NDSOC, they know how to put a show on. Very professional, and it will be the best that they can possibly make it. Yours truly Gordon.

#33 260DET

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Posted 08 November 2011 - 06:43 PM

If the 2013 Nat sprints are going to be at Phillip Island then by whatever means it takes I will be there. With the 280ZXT if it is still alive :)

#34 dat2kman

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Posted 08 November 2011 - 08:01 PM

Little birdie whispers is that Bathurst FOSC Easter 2012 could???, be go, there will be some form of contract for a couple of years extra, no doubt. With council.

Now, if, and a bloody big if, say two organising parties COULD get togethwr, shate costs, bring more entrants, cars, show and shine, social things, etc, along to a group that KNOWS HOW to run a meeting at the most iconic track in this country, then it is a win for all.
Mercedes did it in 2008 porsche in 2010, Datsuns in 2013???

BUT god forbid, that two separate organisatipns can work together!
Just little birdie whispets, at this stage???

#35 Graeme

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Posted 09 November 2011 - 01:06 PM

Funny you say that Jason,
I had preliminary discussions with FOSC following the 2010 event, about holding a Nissan / Datsun day on the Easter Monday following the 2011 Goulburn Nats.
As you are aware, Bathurst FOSC 2011 didn't happen and as such discussions came to a halt.

My understanding of one of the reasons FOSC didn't go ahead in 2011 was something about only one organisation being able to run regularity blah blah and also that part of the event was for car manufacturers to get involved with product launches and the like. 
If this is the case, then each year a different manufacturer could support the event and all the revelant clubs attached to that manufacturer attend.

2012, being the "off" year of the NDNs, would be awesome to hold a Nissan focused FOSC event.


#36 .

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Posted 09 November 2011 - 01:48 PM

I had the same understanding regarding "only one organisation running a regularity at the mountain" but nobody treats it as a regularity anyway so lets run an economy run ;) ......................The person who can complete 5 laps and check their economy the quickest wins :D

#37 dat2kman

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Posted 10 November 2011 - 09:30 PM

Not relevant on topic, but in the "off"year of 2012, the three day june queens birthday long weekend is vacant at Morgan Park Warwick.
The z club up hete sort of booked it, but have dcided that it doesnt want to be bothered going ahead, as some reckon it is financially a risky thing to do.
Morgan Park track hire, and ancilliary costs, including cams permit, medical crews, fire marshalls, and other things needed, would cost aporox 12 to 14 k. Entry fee of $160 per car, times max of 120 , min of 80, would pay?

I have suggested to FOSC to bring their circus to Warwick, and was met with enthusiasm!

Big question is how many southernets would come up for three days of motorsport, with a show and shine, and Satday Nite 1/8 th mile straight line event?
Can people still afford, and have ability, to travel to largish events?
There arent too many personnel that are CAMS qualified to run these things at a club level basis, here in Qld!

#38 260DET

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Posted 10 November 2011 - 09:56 PM

Run the 'kamikaze' circuit from the top of the hill down into the new circuit part, that would liven up boring Morgan Park and create some interest  ;D  Problem is most Zeds in Q run 5:1 diffs so anything over 100kph is problematical, only a slight exaggeration for stirring  purposes :)

I think it says something that virtually no clubs in Q run CAMS sprints anymore, other than the WDSCC of course. I was involved a couple of Q Nationals back in organising the CAMS sprint at QR and swore then that it would be the last one, they are just too frustrating and time consuming to expect volunteers without experience to organise them. Then there is the requirement for officials, the Z Car Club Q Inc has one, one, member who is CAMS qualified and I gather he has had enough too.

Which is why the next Q Nats sprints should be held at Lakeside.

#39 1600dave

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Posted 11 November 2011 - 10:02 AM

I would definitely come up, I love a good road trip.

Good to meet other people and a much more "relaxed" way to do stuff than a single day event where I get up before dawn, drive a few hours to the track, unpack all my stuff, do the event, pack up and drive home exhausted.

I could be wrong, but I think one reason why FoSC had to cancel their meeting scheduled for this weekend at Wakefield Park (due to low entry numbers) is that they under-estimated this aspect of their events. They were trying to "condense" things so that (despite the whole event running over three days) each individual entrant only attended one day for all their events. The intent was stated to be reducing accomodation costs / etc for entrants, but perhaps the lack of entries indicates that people treat these events as a social event as well as simply a race meeting ?



#40 be-zed

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 12:47 PM

Would it be possible to hold a Z Car NATIONALS in the off year of the Nissan Datsun Nationals in an other State ?
Or would this be spreading things to thin to be able to organise?




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