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L28 block brace/girdle


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#41 peter mc

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 06:59 PM

The beauty of this girdle is that you dont have to do any machining.
There is no need because this bolts to the top of the main tunnels with spaces.

#42 luvemfast

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Posted 01 December 2010 - 10:12 PM

Simon dont waste your time doing all that

Geez Daniel, I've already done the hard work mate.
The time is spent, I can't get it back.
These were available previously, but have made some minor improvements.

#43 dazzed

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 08:19 AM

Geez Daniel, I've already done the hard work mate.
The time is spent, I can't get it back.
These were available previously, but have made some minor improvements.

oh sorry Simon , not wasted time , i fitted one to and engine a while ago and quite a few were made at the same time, there is some block machining to do which is a must , the idea of the brace/ Girdle isnt so much about block flexing is about main caps moving it just so happens the girdle bolts to the sump bolts bit of a double wammy, there is a lot of very carefull work required to fit this and a procedure put in place, cleaniness, and everything in top condition as you dont want to pull it apart once u have done it in a hurry. cheers Dan

#44 Gareth. J.

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 05:32 PM

I have no idea with this sort of mod but..........How thick is this girlde? Will there be enough clearance between the lower sump and the crossmember? Also seeing as it fits between the block and sump will the oil pick up need a spacer to ensure it stays deep enough in the sump?

#45 peter mc

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 05:54 PM

there is no mods to the block in this girdle . it is 6mm thick and the oil pickup bolts through to the block

#46 MaygZ

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 06:42 PM

will the oil pick up need a spacer to ensure it stays deep enough in the sump?


Put a little more oil in the car.  Somebody asked earlier about modifying the dip stick, but this too confused me as another 0.5 litre of oil would do it all some good.  And before someone pipes up with comments about the crank hitting the extra oil, remember that the sump is a mm or 2 lower.

Maygz (having yet another cranky day due to decreases in Karma)

#47 peter mc

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 07:45 PM

the  pick up is in the same spot in the sump. the dip stick will read 6mm lower but it will have the same amount of oil ...

#48 Gareth. J.

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 12:30 PM

As I am getting one of these, what/how many bolts are required and where can I get them from? There will be more silly questions from me I just can't think of any yet  :P

#49 luvemfast

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 03:06 PM

As I am getting one of these, what/how many bolts are required and where can I get them from? There will be more silly questions from me I just can't think of any yet  :P

Which bolts do you speak?
Sump bolts will need to be longer (≈6mm), you will need some M8 countersunk cap screws (unbrako) and some longer mains studs (ARP).
Although, Gerhard has just used long Unbrako SHCS with hardened washers for his mains, and that motor has been together for years.
You'll also need 10.5mm thick washers, Ø6.8mm drill and M8 tap.

#50 DatZed

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 06:36 PM

+1 for me. PM me with price and bank details.

#51 ozconnection

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Posted 27 March 2011 - 08:57 AM

This topic has been a little quiet of late, thought I'd wake it up!

I've very recently asked the question over on hybridz as to whether a girdle was really necessary for the L series.
Tony D wrote that it wasn't. He said that back in the Electramotive days when they were running their awesome 700HP L28 turbo, they only upgraded the bottom end to ARP main studs. No girdle was ever used.

The leaking oil was mentioned and Tony D suggested that it may be a PCV issue that was blowing oil out the rear seals. I'd like to know how much the standard PCV system can flow? Modifying the engine and revving it harder will naturally increase the volume of blowby gasses. With the crankcase becoming pressurized, oil is going to be 'squeezed' out at some point. Some engine builders claim more horsepower by using a vacuum pump on their crankcases, claiming that they get reduced windage. Oil will cling to a rotating crank due to negative pressure, so if the rest of the crankcase is negative pressure, then the preference is for the oil to drop to the sump rather than cling to the crank. Negative crankcase air pressure eliminates parasitic drag, oil leaks and cylinder wall overoiling so contamination detonation is reduced, allowing for more timing/compression etc for more power. 

Bearing wear noted. I've found that the tension created from the alternator/water pump belt will cause the crank to flex ever so slightly in the direction of the pull, causing a bearing wear to be found at the front and correspondingly at the back of the engine/crank main bearings.

The crank is long and whip and flex is going to happen, electramotive just used ARP main studs....do we really need anything more down there?  ;)







#52 peter mc

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Posted 27 March 2011 - 09:50 AM

I have found that the arp studs are better but I still had
rear main leaks .
Have found that the block brace is a great help at reducing bearing wear and the rear main nearly stopped leaking.
Also I have found that the Arizona sump has been a big help at stiffing up the bottom end as the rails are pretty thick.
Also guys at electromotive ran dry sumps which would help as they would have run vacuum in the sump and their engine would have been rebuilt every time they went out which would help the situation.

#53 luvemfast

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Posted 27 March 2011 - 08:49 PM

If you're going to rebuild your motor after ever event, then maybe dont consider the girdle.
But most of us will rebuild every 5-10 years.
As originally stated, these were used by one of the pioneers of Z racing here on Victoria. He was a smart cookie, still holds the lap record at the Island in an L series powered Z. So knew what he was doing. Also told me it will increase the harmonic vibration further up the rev range.

All I'm doing is making them available again.

#54 luvemfast

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Posted 27 March 2011 - 09:03 PM

As Peter said,
They rebuilt after each event.
But we want longevity.......... Don't we?

These are nothing new, just haven't been available for 10 years.
One is fitted to a stroker motor that has been in LOTS of MSCA events over the last 10 years.

All I'm doing is making them available again

#55 luvemfast

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Posted 04 April 2011 - 11:48 AM

Well after posting on HybridZ, asking for experience and opinions. I have failed to receive a reasonable response.
They didn't use them back in the 70's.
You don't want to add more weight.
Electramotive didn't use them.
L series blocks can handle 1000hp on the dyno with ARP studs.
Incorrect PCV settings.
Detonation.

I would trust Neils opinion over these responses anyday.
I'm spending thousands on my engine, $200 to help protect it and help it last longer is nothing in my book!

#56 PZG302

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Posted 04 April 2011 - 12:22 PM

Well after posting on HybridZ, asking for experience and opinions. I have failed to receive a reasonable response.
They didn't use them back in the 70's.
You don't want to add more weight.
Electramotive didn't use them.
L series blocks can handle 1000hp on the dyno with ARP studs.
Incorrect PCV settings.
Detonation.

I would trust Neils opinion over these responses anyday.
I'm spending thousands on my engine, $200 to help protect it and help it last longer is nothing in my book!



Mmmmm, and where are all these mythical 1000hp l series engines....Oh I see one now being airlifted by a squadron of pigs over near that Unicorn ;D

#57 nat0_240_chevZ

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Posted 04 April 2011 - 12:50 PM

if it makes you feel better, then why not.
wont bolw up you bottom end.
BUT if there were to be an oil pick up leak lets say, good night L-series big end......
get my drift, make sure oil pickup integrity is of upmost imprtance.
nat0

#58 luvemfast

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Posted 04 April 2011 - 01:09 PM

Mmmmm, and where are all these mythical 1000hp l series engines....Oh I see one now being airlifted by a squadron of pigs over near that Unicorn ;D

Yeah, I know.
Guess it's different in the northern hemisphere.
You know they have cars that explode on impact up there too  ;D




#59 luvemfast

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Posted 04 April 2011 - 09:46 PM

BUT if there were to be an oil pick up leak lets say, good night L-series big end......
get my drift, make sure oil pickup integrity is of upmost imprtance.

Good point, this should be done right in any build though

#60 luvemfast

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Posted 15 April 2011 - 09:45 AM

I only have 1 left, which i need for my own build.

Is there any point in getting some more made?
or
have those who wanted them, all got one?

Any interest?




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