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#1 Mr260z

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 09:21 PM

Hey guys,

A mate and I are considering getting into Super sprints and Hillclimbs
Neither of us have done it before accept for some buggy racing in the early years.
Realistically we are only likely to do 3 or 4 meets a year but we're happy with that .

So anyway I don't want use the Zed at this stage so we are looking for something cheapish to get us started in.

It will be Datsun, either

200b
Stanza
180b
1600
I suppose maybe even a 280zx or rough cheap 260z
Maximum initial budget would be $5k but cheaper the better.
I do know there will be plenty of ongoing cost.

So I want to know pros and cons of these cars and what's the minimum mods we would need for a bit of track fun. We're not all that serious or competitive ( yet )

Any advice would be great and if you know of any cars that would be appreciated toi

#2 dat2kman

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 10:19 PM

Grab a Datsun Sunny sedan, SR20DET or CA18DET and box into it, diff from a 620/720 Ute.
Lowered adjustable coilovers on front, heaps f wrecker yard vented brakes/ multi piston calipers out there.
Drum rear end will get tested ( convert to R31 disc rear.
Turn main spring leaf at rear upside down. Decemt shocks all round.

The above will stretch your 5k budget a bit, but be clse.
The Sunny was the first wide body cars, good track width, lighter unibody steel.

#3 zzzzed

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Posted 24 July 2014 - 10:40 PM

At the momnt I am racing a bone stock 260z 2 seater in road regoed class. While I am getting my rb25det 240z up and running. You don't need to spend much to get started. I'll my 260z has is a second hand set of track tyres, a fire extinguisher tow hooks and compulsory stickers to show where the battery and tow hooks are.

I am far from quickest out there. But I am not the slowest either.
You can add to your car as you go and wAtch the lap times fall as youake improvements.
I would go for safety equipment before performance upgrades.

It doesn't matter what you race weather it's a hyundi exel of a 911
It's still an awesome amount of fun. Start of small and build it up.

I think if I Evers wreck my 24Oz on the track I would prob buy a r32 skyline as they are cheap and off the shelf performance parts are plentiful.

#4 Lurch ™

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 07:23 AM

None of the above. They are all too slow & they are too hard to get parts for.

R33 Skyline or S13 Silvia.
Cheap, faster than an old 4cyl Dato, heaps of aftermarket support and spares parts availability.

#5 benny

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 09:49 AM

None of the above. They are all too slow & they are too hard to get parts for.

R33 Skyline or S13 Silvia.
Cheap, faster than an old 4cyl Dato, heaps of aftermarket support and spares parts availability.



agreed... running pig silvia can be had for sub 2K and then its all just bolt ons

#6 260DET

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 10:22 AM

Yeh, look around for any of the above in a non runner and in poor visual condition but with a sound, straight body. Preferably with some performance extras like coilovers, bigger brakes and so on. Poor appearance and not running are the two factors which bring prices way down.

#7 1600dave

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 10:22 AM

I'm with Lurch (as much as I hate to admit it) - if you want to go very fast for cheap, get something like he suggests.

However, if you want to stick with an old Datsun, I'd go for a sunny / bluebird / stanza (cheaper and still a reasonable mount of spares around). Earlier ones are getting too expensive and hard to get bits for. A 1600, for example, will eat up your entire budget (or more) just to buy one (unless you want a special lightweight racing shell, ie more rust holes than metal). 180B and 200B might be an option if you can get one cheap enough.

I've been running my 1600 in supersprints / regularity / hillclimbs for the last 7 or 8 years, and accept that it is comparitively slow. I'm happy to just get out there and have a go, and work improving both the car and my driving each time I go out. Heaps of fun, and I reckon I get by as cheaply as possible so the fun per dollar ratio is quite good.

Minimum mods ? Aim for mods to make it safe and reliable. New / overhauled brakes with good pads that will stand up to track work. Same for cooling system. Having seen a few accidents now, I'd get a cage (cheap bolt in Bond one will do). Good helmet and a HANS. Harness and race seat (makes a big difference not sliding around in the car while you try to steer). Upgraded suspension (just springs and shocks for a start) and good tyres will make it more fun.

Really, that's all you need to start. Get out and have fun, you'll go faster than the bloke who is still building the ultimate track weapon in his shed (and will be for the next 5 years). Do a driving course - this will bring a bigger improvement in lap times than any modification you make to the car for the same money (or get someone to mentor / sit in with you - I do events with the FoSC and they run a "Masters" program with track walks / advice from old race drivers, with the emphasis on old although their advice is great).



#8 zzzzed

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 11:14 AM

Geez. I said it first and lurch gets all the credit ::) hahaha

#9 PB260Z

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:02 PM

Do a driving course - this will bring a bigger improvement in lap times than any modification you make to the car for the same money (or get someone to mentor / sit in with you - I do events with the FoSC and they run a "Masters" program with track walks / advice from old race drivers, with the emphasis on old although their advice is great).


Never a truer word spoken !

#10 Mr260z

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:40 PM

Driving course definately on the cards first.
Yeah I'm definately more interested in learning in something slow than having something with big power that I don't know how to use anyway. When I was asking about mods it was more in regards to seats , harnesses , Tyres and suspension.
While I totally agree that an r32 or Silvia is best bang for buck. I think my mate and I are looking to start with something older and slower. Probably edging towards a Stanza as there still fairly cheap initially and it's a little nostalgic for us as it was the first car we got around in almost 20yrs ago.
If we really get the bug we will upgrade in 12 months or so. Wouldn't mind being able to keep something club reg. also initially.

#11 260DET

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 04:31 PM

There are driving courses and there are driving courses, make sure you get one where the car will be evaluated too and where you get plenty of in car time with the instructor. Some are prepared for you to go for it, others get 'uncomfortable' if you do that. I found that reading helped a lot but that depends on the individual.

#12 tir33d

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 11:07 PM

If you can find a good one a 120y coupe. I have a rusty one with the old 1200 motor for khanacross. With a welded diff its awesome. You will want more power, just aim for a ca18 or sr20 transplant when $ and skill permit.
Have to say that my original 280zx cost 1900. Was intercooled turbo 2.8. It went pretty good. Took it to wakefield and did 1.18 I think. But man it was the most fun, people thought I was out of control. Old suspension was classic for sending a telegram about the car coming round.
I flogged that motor for 3 track days, upgraded the brakes with hilux calipers after first day. Blew it up by doing too many laps and getting to hot - although only blew turbo seals.
Now another car later (due to a wall jumping at me) my current ride was 400, but rusty as hell. $30,000 worth of development ($5k brakes, $5k drysump, 2k suspension, 2k per set of tyres, $5k in old ls1 chev, + numerous bits) I am heaps faster, to the point I wonder if I have the edge to drive it (although I have a pretty good go everytime)
Roll cage is important - up to $5k for a full service job, cheap as $600 for a weld in kit that you have to notch and weld.
Do the minimum to get the car that you want, once playing the game you will be willing to spend more on development.
Don't forget the tow vehicle and trailer......

#13 zzzzed

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 12:54 AM

Does any one do weld in cages for the s30?

#14 HKSZ

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 01:07 AM

I'm contemplating the same thing with my Zed rally cars, what can I build for $5-6 grand?

coz the last rally I did was at night, it rained all day, the mud turned to soup and I'm swinging the car probably worth $15 grand btn trees and stumps.

Mission statement - buy a running car under $3000 add $2500 cage, have fun then spend as I see fit on performance/suspension upgrades etc.

I have two possibilities  RX7  or  90's civic with vtec 1.6

RX7 light car and well developed for racing over the years and prices aren't overboard like a zed. Hell last week I saw a straight body shell on Gumtree  for free in Melbourne, then two days later some grub has the shell on his trailer and wants $400 for it!

90's Civic again light car heaps of tuner parts. I bought a $100 banger last month and did some autocrossing and it's the most RWD handeling FWD I've had on the dirt, felt alot like the 240.

When it comes to racing you need a car with low personal attachment ,best to buy already running and there is alot of gratification in beating big dollar cars with standard or cheap cars, which is probably how we all got in to Dattos anyway... the notorious tight arses we are ;D


#15 boyblunda

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 02:18 AM

FWIW buying the running car is the cheapest value for money alternative - by streets.

Given that you have an S30 on the road, buying a body and getting experience in an S30 can provide you with a bed of experience from which you will benefit later. It is rare for  a person to enter the competitive stage with realistic expectations of winning - what you might need to focus on are realistic, achievable, economic enjoyable experiential goals that allow you to realise optimal  benefits per dollar of investment.

If you already run an S30, by investing in a competition S30 at least any left over parts of the new project might be converted to your current car and the learnings will be immediately transferable.

My thoughts are to focus on longer time realistic goals rather than be distracted by immediate competition results. The first step is to get out there and have some affordable fun.

FWIW


#16 Agno

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 04:52 PM

None of the above. They are all too slow & they are too hard to get parts for.

R33 Skyline or S13 Silvia.
Cheap, faster than an old 4cyl Dato, heaps of aftermarket support and spares parts availability.


Quoted for truth. It is crazy just how cheap parts are for these cars now.

#17 Mr260z

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 12:40 PM

Well our thoughts are starting to shift.
We've seen a nice rx7 series 4 but I'm more keen to stick to nissan.
What about R31 and R32's ?

#18 PZG302

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 02:58 PM

S13 would be cheaper and you should find one that is already modded for track pretty cheap, look for one with a blown motor. The motors are cheap enough to buy standard.

#19 Mr260z

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 08:01 PM

Well I think I've found the car for us.
But I'm not telling anyone about it because I'm sure you'll do your best to talk me out of it.
Thanks for all the advice guys. Atleast now I can make an educated bad choice  ::)
Will be in touch soon Lurch

#20 Lurch ™

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Posted 29 July 2014 - 08:21 PM

Will be in touch soon Lurch


Dear God... How much rust is in it?!




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