DreamZproject Posted January 20, 2014 Author Share Posted January 20, 2014 Ok, last possibility here... Is there any possibility of converting the cars hubs over to something that protrudes roughly an inch more so you can run an 8" rim with 0 offset to fill out the flares? I have thought about welding spacers to the hubs OR the wheels, but each seem to have the problem of possibly untempering the surface it ids to be affixed to. I realised that this would have to be engineered, but it still saves me a ton of cash over going the VOLKS plus i wont find it impossible to buy the correct tyres stocking with an 8" rim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Z Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 I reckon you should just avoid going flares. It will save you a fair abit of coin on cutting/welding, hardware and the flares themselves. Then you can afford to buy the Volks. Or why not just use hub centric bolt on spacers?. Just torque them once a month and they should be right. Ive used many on previous cars with no issues. Have you had a look at performance superlite/challenger wheels in 15x10/16x10 -27 offset quite cheap at $1200 delivered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dat2kman Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 So, basically this,,, I have here, in Aus sets of 15x9 in neg 13, Watanabe Type R exact copies, $1200 a set includes pstage to you. depending on your flare width, you could quite eadily fit longer NICE 75 mm wheel studs front and rear, and fit slip on spacers, that would meed to be mechanically attached to your front/rear hubs/drums, using a single c/sunk machine screw into a tapped hole only needs to be about a 5mm thread. That way the spacer will mot become a flying saucer if you lose a wheel. The thickness of the spacer, will have some effect on bearing loading, but then again anything wider than a 175 section tyre on a Z will also effect bearing loading. Race cars have been doing this for many years, different scenario, and they are maintained, as should be yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 20, 2014 Author Share Posted January 20, 2014 As I've said. I really really really like the look of the volk/ rota grids and really don't want to have to compromise (minus paying close on 4k!!!). In relation to spacers. I'm sure that they're actually fine to use, but the po-po don't think so, and it would also void my insurance = not cool... I know that some people convert to a 5 stud hub, surely there is something out there that could be adapted that's a couple of centimeters wider??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.A.R. Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 You 'could' cut the old flange off the rear stub axle's & machine up a new 5-stud offset flange and then interference press fit & weld it on. That's not an uncommon mod for live axle half shafts... Fronts you'd just convert to early Ford Falcon 5-stud hubs, which are a direct bolt on, onto the std Zed front struts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 20, 2014 Author Share Posted January 20, 2014 Yup that's the conversion. Is it possible for this to give me the extra offset I need? Or is it just for the benefit of being able to use a 5 stud rim? I'd preffer to stay with a 4 stud as it means I can use the classic jap rims that are 8" as though they were 9". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 So, basically this,,, Plus there are 0 tires in the world that are legal in Australia that will fit on this rim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dat2kman Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Plus there are 0 tires in the world that are legal in Australia that will fit on this rim. Right! Plenty around in 225/50, 225/60, etc, both performance as well as longer life. 15" semis eadier to get than 16's as some on here find. 17's with low profile ie 45 or 40 series, also as some find out, after going that way, give a harsh ride, and due to engineered geometry, are not ideal on older cars, like Z's. You've got flares, you want wide rims that poke out past body shell, you want rubber that will fill out the arch, and fit nicely under the flare without interference. To do that is gonna cost, and there are not that many rim styles or sizes out there that will fill these requirements on an older car, that does not have modern KPI geometry and wider track width on the hub faces, hence the large availability of positive offset, or close to, rims. At a neg 13 offsett, a 9" wide rim will poke out past guards, requiring flares. I can email you pics of that sizing on a standard unflared Z bodyshell. Getting legal road tyres is easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 I have yet not found a single manufacturer that has a 15" tire that they state is made to go on a 9" wide rim. (that will work on a Z) If you could show me one it would make my day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Z Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I have yet not found a single manufacturer that has a 15" tire that they state is made to go on a 9" wide rim. (that will work on a Z) If you could show me one it would make my day! 245/60/15 also came across some 235/60/15 on ebay. http://m.ebay.com.au/itm/321293003622?nav=WATCHING&sbk=1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 a 235/60r15 would throw your speedo out by over 5%, I'm fairly sure this is out of the range of legal. EDIT Yeah, maximum increase in diameter is 15mm going from a stock tyre of 195/70r14 to 235/60r15 gives 35mm difference. A 55 series tire seems ideal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Z Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Your over thinking it. Just get your speedo recalibrated or change out the gearbox sensor gear. S30 speedos aren't that accurate anyway. Do you think a police officer or vicroads officer would know if the speedo was out? You would probably get more negative attention with the flares and fender mirrors than tyre height.. Also 8" wheels would look silly on the back with flares. Just go flare-less. Look how good Mossy's car looks without flares. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 Once again, a darn brickwall with flares... If i had 8" rims sitting out another inch it would look like a 10" rim with the same offset. The thing is i want it legal. I know that more than likely noone would ever notice that the combination I have isn't legal, but if i was to be in an accident for some reason or another, I don't want all the shit involved with having a car that isn't legal. As far as i can tell, 15x9 rims on a Z = Illegal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zedevan Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I think you'll find you're only allowed to increase the total track width of the car by 1", which means you can't do what you want anyway, particuarly if you're defining the maximum 'stock' wheels as 7" that are no where near flush with the stock guards. Fortunately 10" wheels where a factory option and according to the vicroads documentation that's what matters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 Yes that is the clause i was going off to get me up to the 9" but that doesn't help all the other dimensions (unless they are significantly larger...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 Does anyone have this elusive document, I'd like to check it out myself so i can try and find some sort of loophole... (such as, if any car came with spacers you are allowed to run them!) EDIT Ok found it.... doesn't give much away.... Theoretically this should work (Isn't this how 50% of us are getting away with the L28 swap?) to get us to the 10" mark, but doesn't help at all with tires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Z Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Once again, a darn brickwall with flares... If i had 8" rims sitting out another inch it would look like a 10" rim with the same offset. The thing is i want it legal. I know that more than likely noone would ever notice that the combination I have isn't legal, but if i was to be in an accident for some reason or another, I don't want all the shiver involved with having a car that isn't legal. As far as i can tell, 15x9 rims on a Z = Illegal. It would look the same from the side. But from the back it would look substantially skinnier than the 10 inchers. I know what you mean about being legal and all, but if you are looking at welded hubs/spacers etc your more likely to get your insurance void. Insure your car with someone like shannons or Just car and actually add your wheels onto your policy and you will be OK. I've been involved in a couple of accidents with overly modified cars in the past and they never disputed anything as i had the parts listed on my policy. The ride height or suspension itself that you would need for the 15x8's to look good with flares would probably be more illegal than the 5mm difference in tyre height. Many people don't even cut their fenders instead opting to roll the lip or use stiffer springs..maybe you could do that to save you from having to decide now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 Hmmm i think you have it back to front, i want the flared look, but i can't find a legal way to do it with the sort of rims I'm after. I'll be doing everything by the book so suspension will be all good. The difference in the tire height is over an inch larger! (on a 135/60r15) This would surely be noticed by any half intelligent cop. Shame you can't get slightly stretched tires approved by an engineer. Would fix everything... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dat2kman Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Your original stock rim/tyre 175/70x14 had an o/all diam of 630mm A 225/60x15 tyre will give you 650 mm diam Any taller or wider than that you will really foul on front lower guard lips, and tops of rear arches, the flares you have, or want to fit, are how wide? By using say a neg 13 rim in 9" the rim lip edge will be, on stock hubs, front and back, just at the lip edge of the usual type flares, that everyone fits to the Zeds. The 225 width tyre is a safe fitment, and at 60 series is tall enough to give a natural look, ie not ricer/stretched. You will need to get rear guards rolled at arch tops, and the front lower lip on front guards trimmed. Best of all, dont need any spacers to achieve all this. How do i know this? I have done this using the 225/60x15 tyre, that is quite road legal, and very readily available. If you wanted to really push them out further, and that will really stuff the hell out of your King Pin Inclination geometry, yes you could fit longer studs, ie 75 mm, and alloy spacers that ARE attached to your stock hubs, by way of CS machine screw, so that it doesnt come away if the wheel happens to fall off due to a numpty not doing up nuts. How much are you prepared to spend, on your wheels and tyres? What wheel style do you like? And other style options? Why do you want a very tall or overly wide tyre? Have you driven cars fitted with such, to experience the idiosyncracies of these? ( i have!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 22, 2014 Author Share Posted January 22, 2014 Your original stock rim/tyre 175/70x14 had an o/all diam of 630mm A 225/60x15 tyre will give you 650 mm diam Any taller or wider than that you will really foul on front lower guard lips, and tops of rear arches, Still unfortunately Illegal (15mm diameter increase max) If the spacer is attached to the stock hub via some form of grub screw with the longer wheel studs, would it be possible to get engineered? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d3c0y Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 23, 2014 Author Share Posted January 23, 2014 Thanks decoy can always trust you to step in and sort everything out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d3c0y Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 All the answers have been given really and you just don't like them. Most of it is because you don't want to pay what it's worth to do it. No one is going to ping you for 15mm of tyre out of diameter and the short answer is at the end of the day you will just have to make some concessions like the speedo being a bit out to do the cool mods to the car. Most of the "cool" mods are illegal, fender mirrors, changing indicators larger wider wheels. You just have to decide what you deem as an acceptable risk in terms of legality and what concessions you will make in regard to practicality (speedo, cheap tyres etc). This has gone the same way as your engine thread "I want an ITB stroker on the cheap". It may seem like i am being hard on you, but you just need to accept the fact that if it was all easy and cheap to do then there would be heaps of crazy modified Zs around. A lot of this info, actually all of it, can be found from reading existing posts on the forums too. Even though this is a 300zx diagram it works for S30s too: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamZproject Posted January 23, 2014 Author Share Posted January 23, 2014 I somewhat disagree with that triangle. The 4th thing to consider is time. Cost can be diminished when effort it put in. That is essentially my work ethic when it comes to this car, and yes, i have to ask a butt ton of questions to make it possible, but it's not hurting anyone. If you don't want to reply to my posts, I really don't mind. There are some people on here who are very generous with their time and knowledge and enjoy passing on their wisdom. Imagine if, somehow, I managed to discover some sort of development through my researching and querying, imagine the benefit to the community. I don't want a cookie cutter car, and while in general the car will be fairly normal, I don't want to be limited by naysayers and lack of knowledge. So i ask my questions here, and really appreciate when someone spends the time to sit down and share their knowledge, is there any harm in that? Simple solution, if you don't want to reply, you don't. FYI i have once again come to a dead end here, but I am still searching. I have sent an email off to rota to determine what the chances are of them producing a 16x9 wheel (with neg offset). They might say "That's stupid, we wouldn't sell any", but there is always a chance that they are already in the development stage of making such a wheel... This is where the effort factor comes in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Z Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 Rota can make you any size and offset based off any of their current designs if you buy and pay for 10 pairs (20) of that size upfront. That was what i was told by the Rota manufacturer/rep in Philipines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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