240Z - Year of manufacture?

[bluerat]

I've just had a look on the Zhome regisiter and if that is to be beleived, the 1969 Aussie Zed is a myth! If you compare the 240Z on the WA register no. 00030 with engine number in the late 9000's to the US car's it was built in July 1970. Like it was mentioned before it may have been built before and set aside, but it looks likes it was finished in mid 1970. The two earlier cars on the HS30 list on the USA site are both quoted to be built in 1970.

What do you think? This looks to me to be an easy way to check any date, as long as the L24's were fitted in numbered order. Or an I barking up the wrong tree, or barking mad, lol.


Catch ya,

Hodgo

[GV260]

Attached are the additional tables/pages in order from the Fairlady publication so you can follow it properly. I've attached the first page again given the quality wasn't great. Build numbers for HLS30 cars are on the second page (in table 2). The third page (table 3) is for S30 but I have no idea what they relate to given the Japanese text.

[GV260]

Table 2

[GV260]

Table 3

[zedrally]

Very interesting guy's. I've alway been told the pre '69 Aussie Zed's were a myth started so people could run a certain historic race class? Alan would you have a list to compare very early engine numbers to work out a build date?

Bluerat, don't confuse the datto with the zed. There are no pre '69 zeds. The misconception that you heard was based on the Datsun 1600 (Datto). I'll preface the following by saying this happened in the Rally world, not circuit, so the outcome may have effected the circuit boys, it may not have either.

There was a protest made after the running of a certain HRA rally (don't ask which one) about the substitution of a 4 speed box with a 5 speed box in a 1600, until then, all the 1600 owners where  running in HRC Cat2 (68-75). The protest discovered that the 5 speed was a homogated option from the Sports 2000 which was allowed to be fitted as a option, it also discovered that the 1600 was built and homogated prior to 68, which then allowed them to compete in HRC Cat 1.(which really peaved the protesters and  still to this day brings cringing faces when mentioned in the right company )

As to pre 70 zeds in Australia, I'm know that over the years that this has been debated (many times in ClassicZcar) that it was agreed that 004 was the earliest and possibly didn't arrive here until the 1st Quarter of 1970. The actual month has never been established, only presumed. There is little doubt that it certainly had been built in '69, as to it's actual location in '69(Japan or Australia) is unknown.
It may have been in Australia in '69, it may not have.
As for the register in Zhome, forget it, it confuses everyone with it's numbers of HLS-30 and basically ignores the fact that there where S-30's built pre 70. In actual fact until Alan T took some of the claims to task, it actually distributed mis-information and didn't reflect the actual status of the S-30 and it's many variants. We can all thank Alan for his stand otherwise the history of the S-30 would still be distorted.
There are many excellent threads and discussions on this however make sure you read the right information otherwise you may fall into the trap of believeing a certain German was responsible for the S-30......
regards...

[Mr Camouflage]

As to pre 70 zeds in Australia, I'm know that over the years that this has been debated (many times in ClassicZcar) that it was agreed that 004 was the earliest and possibly didn't arrive here until the 1st Quarter of 1970. The actual month has never been established, only presumed. There is little doubt that it certainly had been built in '69, as to it's actual location in '69(Japan or Australia) is unknown.

Little doubt? There is just no way of knowing when HS30-00004 was built unless someone like Katz can uncover the production info with chassis numbers for the rest of 1969 (September to December), or whoever owns #4 does the component date checking thing, or compares engine numbers with US cars.

Nissan state that HS30-00003 was built in October 1969, but that doesn't mean they completed #4 in 1969 either.

It's possible, there's just no proof to say either way.

Likewise there is no way to tell when the car arrived in Australia, unless records can be unearthed from somewhere.

If indeed car #4 was the car that was lent out to magazines for articles, and used in the press release kit then it was in the hands of Australian Modern Motor magazine in October 1970. They drove it to the 1970 Hardie-Ferodo 500 at Bathurst.

Press release kit was released in September, so the only thing we know for sure is that the car arrived in Australia before September 1970. How long before is anyone's guess. Zhome say it arrived in March, though they provide no supporting evidence.

[zedrally]

Sigh.....
This has been discussed ad infinitum on ClassicZCar. (see the link I posted prior).
Unfortunately, it all gets lost in the passage of time, this occurance happened approximately 13  years ago and no doubt will be raised in another 13 years by another reader who tries to unravel the facts!
The previous owner of 004 (who I knew personally), had all the details that supported the claim, he was very proud of being able to display them when the car was on display in the occaisional "Show & Shine"
 
This is the same car that is reported in Zhome by Carl Beck the US Z Car guru, who had been in contact with the owner.
Before anyone ask's, I do not know who brought the car and where it went to. (There has been speculation that it's in Japan, draw you're own conclusion's)
Now as to the actual build date, it's easy to presume that it was '69, as it followed 003. Logically, why would you halt the build in October and recommence the next year?
I wouldn't, wouldn't you?
In the end, I really don't care. Like 004's past owners, I'll shut up and let everyone else draw their own conclusions....

[bluerat]

Sorry Adrian that was a miss print, eliminate 'Pre' from the above, my stuff up. I am a big 1600 fan, and I know the problems the boys in Nc etc are having with the 5 speeds but I did mean the 240Z. I have a 68 1600 in stock if you want to upset any pompus HRC boy's! It's a fine line over the date debate and in the overall scheme of thing's doesn't really matter, unless you own an early car and want it dated with-in a month or two? The car itself and the enjoyment it brings you is the important thing.

[Mr Camouflage]

Sigh.....
This has been discussed ad infinitum on ClassicZCar. (see the link I posted prior).
Unfortunately, it all gets lost in the passage of time, this occurance happened approximately 13  years ago and no doubt will be raised in another 13 years by another reader who tries to unravel the facts!

Yes it has, I was there at the time on classic z cars, and all comments on #00004 on classic z cars seem to think rightly or wrongly that it was built in 1970. Carl believes the car was made in 1970. Alan also agreed that the car may have been built in 1970. I even read on Classic Z cars that the cars owner believed the car was built in 1970. In fact after all these years and all those discussions, Mike, this is the first time I've ever seen you say it was built in 1969.

The previous owner of 004 (who I knew personally), had all the details that supported the claim, he was very proud of being able to display them when the car was on display in the occaisional "Show & Shine"

What claim is that exactly? That the car arrived here in 1970. With that I don't disagree, but whether it was made in 1969, Who knows? maybe, maybe not. Are you saying it is a 1969 car? You said earlier that there are no 1969 HS30's.

It's entirely possible that some low number HS30's were made in 1969, I'm not disagreeing with you there, but there's no documented evidence of the kind katz has been able to uncover that proves either way the build date, that i'm aware of.

The first load of 240Z's were sold in 1970 as 1970 models, regardless of whether they were built in 1969.

It discussions like this that help to bring out evidence and dispel the myths associated with these cars. I'm interested in hearing more about #4 Mike, so please don't shut up, tell us what you know.